This episode of On Point features a conversation between Lisa Benitez, the Chief Diversity Officer at the United States Military Academy West Point, and Herman Bulls, International Director and the founder of JLL's Public Institutions Business Unit.
This episode of On Point features a conversation between Lisa Benitez, the Chief Diversity Officer at the United States Military Academy West Point, and Herman Bulls, International Director and the founder of JLL's Public Institutions Business Unit.
Herman also serves on several high-impact public, private and not-for-profit boards including USAA, The American Red Cross, The Military Bowl, Comfort Systems USA, American Campus Communities, and the West Point Association of Graduates. He is founder, President, and CEO of Bulls Advisory Group, a real estate and management advisory firm. Herman completed 12 years of active duty service with the United States Army, and retired as a Colonel in the U.S. Army Reserves in 2008. He is part of the West Point graduating class of 1978 and received a MBA from Harvard Business School.
In this episode, Herman talks about leading the initial charge for diversity, equity, and inclusion at West Point. As well, gives insight into how the school has continued to expand those efforts across the organization from the board, staff, and faculty to athletics, admissions, and alumni. He helped establish, and was the first chair, of the AOG board’s diversity committee, and continues to support West Point AOG to be the most connected and inclusive alumni group in the world.
---------------
“When we were focusing on it [Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion], my intent was that I certainly want it to be totally inclusive and we need to make sure we include all of our graduates for all minorities. We need to include everybody. However, my objective, when I set this up, was to say, we're going to focus on the African-American graduate body and we're going to get them engaged, and we're going to make this academy better for everybody. That was the intent of it.” - Herman Bulls
---------------
(00:40) Herman’s Involvement in Diversity and Inclusion Initiatives
(03:55) How Diversity and Inclusion was initially received at West Point
(05:45) West Point Diversity Conference
(09:30) Diversity and Inclusion Representation among Staff and Faculty
(11:55) Establishment of Diversity and Inclusion Committee as Part of Board
(12:55) Herman’s Role as Chair of Diversity and Inclusion Board
(15:00) Diversity and Inclusion Representation for Athletes
(15:51) West Point Special Interest Groups
(16:50) Corporate Governance
(17:15) Diversity Makeup within Board and Advisory Committee
(20:44) Importance of Candid Conversations
(24:10) Minority Visitation Program and other Diversity and Inclusion Initiatives
(28:00) Need for Resources
(28:45) Diversity and Inclusion Role in West Point Alumni Connectivity
(35:45) Herman’s West Point Experience vs. his Son’s
(40:25) Philanthropy and Margin of Excellence Program
(47:00) Post Graduate Scholarship Distribution and Awards for Minorities
---------------
West Point Association of Graduates
Narrator: [00:00:00] Hello, and welcome to OnPoint. This episode features a conversation between Lisa Benitez, the chief diversity officer at the United States, military academy, west point and Herman Bulls, international director, and the founder of JLLs public institutions, businesses. Herman also serves on several high impact public private and not-for-profit boards, including USA, the American red cross, the military Comfort systems USA, American campus communities, and the west point association of graduates. He is founder, president and CEO of bulls advisory group, a real estate and management advisory firm. Herman completed 12 years of active duty service with the United States army and retired as a Colonel in the U S army reserves in 2000.
He is part of the west point graduating class of 1978 and received an MBA from Harvard business school. And this episode, Herman talks about leading the [00:01:00] initial charge for diversity equity and inclusion at west point as well, gives insight into how the school has continued to expand those efforts across the organization from the board staff and faculty to athletics admissions.
He helped establish and was the first chair of the AOG board's diversity community, and continues to support west point AOG to be the most connected and inclusive alumni group in the world. Now, please enjoy this interview between Lisa Benitez and Herman bowls.
Lisa Benitez: Hi, my name is Lisa and I'm here with Herman bulls classes of V8 and Herman. I don't know if you remember when we first, well, not when we first met, but when we reunited, it was almost 25 years ago in may of 1997. I was my first day coming back to west point being hired at this west point association of graduates.
And it was actually a board meeting and. It [00:02:00] really looking back. That really was what started me on the path that I'm in now. And now in this capacity as a chief diversity officer here at west point. And just thinking about that, when did you know in your life that you were going to lead for diversity and inclusion efforts at west
Herman Bulls: point?
Well, first of all, Lisa, great to be here and great to see you. And of course your class 19. 88 is a class that I taught at west point as I was on the faculty from 85 to 88. And of course, one of your best friends, Andrea was one of my students. And I think, uh, it's been a pleasure to be associated with your, your class.
And as we think about west point, you know, every superintendent says we actually graduate two classes. So it's a class of cadets and of course it's that class of faculty and staff that we put back into the army as well. So it's, uh, it's all good. Well, you, you know, Lisa, I don't ever think I had an aspiration or a thought that I would [00:03:00] lead diversity.
West point. However, I have been since I was a little kid as somewhat of a, of a leader, uh, you know, as president of my high school student council, I was quarterback and football and all of those things. And not that I tried to do anything, but I just did the things that were, you know, I felt appropriate for the time.
And certainly the things that west point that really started me thinking about diversity, believe it or not was the experience I had in my graduate program at Harvard business school. And if you think about west point and one of the things that you always knew, we had really small classes of minority students or cadets or graduates every year, and you have these reunions.
And by the way, I've gone to every one of my reunions. However, some people that don't have a very good experience, they choose not to participate. And we had something at Harvard business school, where as opposed to just participating in your reunion class, we started an organization called [00:04:00] African-American student union of just the American.
And what that did. It gave you a, uh, economy. So to speak of scale, that you could look at issues that were in the best interest of the students at the time, and also in the best interest of the graduates. So that organization student led student run, they would put on a conference every year and they would make the invitation out to all of the African-American graduates.
And that would bring back a really nice group of. And after I graduated and I got involved in the association of graduates, just in terms of being a volunteer, I said, Hmm, if that model work there, would it work at west point? And what I did from there again, I was not a member of the board. However, I wrote a memo basically outlining what I just told you and suggested to the AIG that this is something that we could do.
And of course, being a Harvard business school grad, what I knew is that [00:05:00] resources were in. And part of my rationale was that not only will we get more engaged, This could also be an opportunity to get, you know, more fundraising and get people involved. And obviously we didn't have all the social issues we have now.
And I gotta tell you, Lisa, initially it was probably received not with resistance, but I'll say suspicion. 'cause some people were like, you know, I was actually at the time a reserve officer teaching in the department of social sciences and the word on the street was, Hey, there's some reserve officer up here is trying to start a black ALG.
And it was, it was so funny. I remember my response was, oh, no, no, no, no. I would never do that. I want to use your infrastructure to do what needs to be done because we don't have the capital or the money to try to have a separate organization. So it was never was an intent of having a separate organism.
And, and from there, I just always been a person to try to not see things as they are, but think about what they should be. And [00:06:00] that's a little idealistic. I know, but in the, in the process I had no problems. Shy Meyer was the chairman of the ALG mint and Francis and Minton is from the class of, uh, 44, the first African-American to be on the EOG board.
I got introduced to him in between talking to the two of them. You know, basically came up and said, Hey, I got this idea how we can invigorate our African-American graduate body and let's try to get them together. And from that, Lisa working with my classmate Curtis Harris, who happens to be on the board now it took us a year and a half to do this.
So I'm basically making it go short. You know, I, I wrote, you know, Vince Brooks, for example, you know, he was a major, I think, at the time. And he mentioned. When he spoke at west point a few years ago, and I just wanted to make sure there was some groundswell support for this idea and for this effort. And we put together the first diversity conference is what it came from.[00:07:00]
And as you're aware, Lisa, that conference used to be sponsored. And the initial ones for probably the first eight to 10 years were sponsored by. And it was so great. We went out, one of my classmates worked at Coke. They gave us $10,000. My from JLL gave money and we not only were self-sufficient in pulling this conference together.
It also made money and the graduates had such a great time. So it was a combination of just getting together for fellowship. Good music. We still had academy officials speak, uh, you know, to give an update. And that was the start of that, which resulted in a few years later, us actually having a diversity committee on the ALG board.
Lisa Benitez: I remember that first, I think it was called minority. Outreach conference. I was like a 1996, the fall of 1996. And it was, as you indicated, an AOJ conference getting the alumni together, and then some years later that shift to the [00:08:00] academy, how do you feel about that switch? Do you think is still accomplishing, um, the intentions that from the original conference.
Herman Bulls: Well, let, let me start by saying, first of all, Lisa, we have to understand that the EOG, that our goal and our role is to support the superintendent in the academy. So how I may feel about it in terms of personally, you have to come back and say, what is our role? And, you know, I got to tell you to be totally transparent when the academy first took it over, it really lost a lot of.
Okay, because what it is when I say it lost focus, because it was trying to be everything to everybody and the African-American cadets who had become accustomed to this event, you know, they came up and, you know, west, point's not easy to get to. It's expensive. It's hard. We generally had it in the cold weather months anyway, and people came and all of a sudden it wasn't the fellowship.
Of what they had experienced in the previous [00:09:00] five or six years. But at the same time, the academy from their perspective from department of army had basically said everybody needs to do something about diversity. So I think the superintendent at that time said, oh, we got this thing, which is, you know, the academy was certainly supporting ed, but the content was done by IOG.
And then the content got switched from the AIG to the academy. I think we did a better job and not talking about somebody better or whatever, when we were focusing it on, you know, my intent, I certainly want to be totally inclusive and we need to make sure we include all of our graduates for all minorities.
So from the Hispanics, Asian, Latin, whatever we need to include everybody. However, my objective, when I set this up was to say, we're going to focus on the African-American graduate body and we're going to get them engaged, and we're going to make this academy better for everybody. That was, that was the intent of it.
So sometimes when you try to be everything [00:10:00] to everybody, you lose a little focus. And as a result of that, the participation from the African-American graduates reduced significantly over the next few.
Lisa Benitez: Yeah. And I always recall when you would bring up the topics of diversity at west point, you wrote off often say this what gets measured gets done.
And, um, I think you would agree that with our DEI efforts here at west point, especially in admissions, we, we always make a point to say, we have goals, not quotas. So. Are you optimistic where we are now in 2022, as far as the academy,
Herman Bulls: I'm optimistic. There's no doubt. I mean, you look at the leadership at the academy.
Now you've got an African-American superintendent. You've got an African-American. Coming out of cadets, you know, that's not going to last forever. And I think previous superintendents I've worked with, you know, every one of them for the last 20 years had a personal relationship and been [00:11:00] somewhat of a kitchen cabinet advisor to them.
And I'm certainly I'm moved particularly by the results that we've had in the admissions office. However, they are an area where I've spoken to, to, you know, general Williams about, and I've spoken to the Dean about that. Um, you know, very concerned about the. And SAP. Okay. We are not representative there. I understand all of the challenges from the talent, getting out earlier to people thinking that this is not good for their career.
And I tell them, where are you going to stay in the army? Look at this guy named journal Austin. He came back to west point where to sign that or look at bids, Leo Brooks, or if you're going to get out of the army, look at Herman bulls. I mean, things can work out okay. Coming back to the academy. So I think that can be overcome something.
However, that is an area that, you know, like everything else, if it doesn't get measured, people do not understand the product. And you may or may not get it done so that the staff and faculty representation for, for [00:12:00] women as well as minorities, I think that's definitely an area that deserves attention.
And, and Lisa, that brings up, I had the privilege, I've been on a board a long time and no one will probably ever be on the board. As long as me again. We had several changes during the process, which every time they changed the structure, kind of the limit of the number of years change. So I've been on the board for a long, a matter of fact, I probably on the board more than anybody in the history of the, of the ALG and part of that continuation is, is sort of good.
And from the aspect as we look to. Kind of what do we do? So the ALG finally, about eight or nine years ago, we established the diversity committee, you know, a formal committee, which is a committee of the board before everything was just done ad hoc. And with that, my good friend, Archie ELAM led that for the initial, one of the initial leaders of that.
And at the time, the only thing that that committee [00:13:00] did was work on the conference that. And, uh, you don't do Francisco. I think I was already, I've been chair of the audit committee. I've been, let's see, chair of the compensation committee. And he asked me, he said, Herman, will you take on the diversity committee?
I'd like for you to be able to do whatever Archie left the board. And then I took over as chair of that committee. Well, as you know, Lisa you're on a committee, we got about 20 people. And the only thing we're talking about is this, this, this conference that happens once a year, where in reality, we did not have the influence over it that we had before.
So it was a supporting role and there's nothing wrong with that. As long as it will happen to the academy. And as I thought about it, when Joe asked me about it, I said, well, you know, I think we've got to do more with this committee. So as I thought about my experience in corporate America, I serve on several fortune 500 boards and I really see governance at his best.
I said two things. Let's look at this to see how can we truly make a difference for the [00:14:00] academy, because that's why we're here. And number two, how can you get more people involved? Because everybody that goes to west point is a leader and they want to be involved. Some of them are waiting to be tapped on the shoulder, but given the opportunity west point graduates come on and they produce.
So I said, okay, let's do this. Let's try to think from my corporate structure, what are all the things that need to be looked at that you have as committees on a board? So I thought about it. I said, okay, what are the areas that Westpoint perhaps needs help in? Let's start with it now. So we had an admission subcommittee that we worked with the admissions office.
Again, not making policy, helping them implement, whether it be from the cadet CPRC public relations program to helping with, uh, recruiting, et cetera. Then the next thing you do is you say, okay, We've got this thing called and faculty, which I spoke of is an area that I think needs, um, um, some more [00:15:00] work.
And as you know, at least that you've been working with me for the time that I was chair on that. And by the way, we now have a new chair of that committee and we know that, uh, Sally. It's going to lead that going forward, Sally Lewis. But that committee were looked at, okay. We will work with the Dean. We will work with the commandant.
We will work with the director athletics to help them in any way related to diversity. And speaking to the department of athletics. I remember going to army Navy game. It's probably been about 10 years ago and I'm sitting there and I open up the, uh, the book and it has staff administration for the academy.
There was not one black face on. And you look down at the field and 60, 75% of the kids were black. And that just, I am not the only person that was sitting at that game that knows. And I notice it. And my, I said, well, we've got, you know, this is a discontinuation here, and we've got to think about that, Mike buddy, as you know, I introduce you to him and he's been [00:16:00] phenomenal to work with.
He understands the issue. He wants to work with us and you and the committee to say, what is it that we can do to make sure that the athletic administration is also representative of not only our nation, but the kids that we have out on the field. And then the next thing is thinking about. Special interest groups.
But the idea is that we have west point women. We have the swim team, we have the choir, all of those areas to say, let's look at that to see how we can get more graduates involved and let's make it easier for these organizations to do things. We have a group of African-American graduates to do more.
Those kids have taken what Curtis and I started and they've taken it to a new level. For example, African-American females come into the academy. Most people don't think about it. They got to get their hair done. There's a little. And these guys not only come up and recognize that, but they come up with kits that they give them to make sure that after sweating into fill and [00:17:00] everything, you have some idea of what it's like being a black woman at the academy, in that type of environment.
They're working with admissions, they're working with all of them. So that's, that's great with all of those interest groups. We have another one, we have this, uh, corporate governance. Okay. This one people got a little nervous about, but I was. Like corporate governance is basically saying, let's look at the a O G itself and let's see how we're doing as far as diversity is concerned.
And man, I'm telling you under general different Cisco's efforts. And of course, before him, you know, the other chairman have done a fantastic job. And as we look at the board right now, We have four African-Americans on the board of trustees right now. Okay. And that would be Ron Johnson, 76, Curtis Harris, 78, Dana at 81.
And Erica Jeffries had just started, started there in 98 and then I can't get in all the names. But if you look at the advisory committee, which for those, all of our listeners that don't know, we have the board of directors and we [00:18:00] have also a list of advisors. Who, you know, I would say younger graduates with people that want to get involved.
And west point you can go by your class. You can go by your region. You can go at large. And, and that group out of 52 advisors, 10 of them are women. Okay. That's 19% almost mirrors. What we have at the academy, six of them are, African-American almost 12% and one Asian. And now I'm going to tell you, listeners, this did not happen by.
This happened as a result of leadership and I'll give Jody for it. So again, different Cisco, our former chair, all the credit in the world, because as you know, and everybody should know, the board does not pick board members. The board is picked by graduates who are selected to be on a selection committee.
So there is no institutional Embry and all we did and what we have done because I can't guarantee anybody that's going to be. But I can say that we went out, tap [00:19:00] people on the shoulder and said, have you ever thought about doing this? And most of them had not thought about it. And then they said, oh yeah.
And these individuals are being selected because of their merit, because of the support that they have demonstrated for you.
Lisa Benitez: Thank you for bringing that, um, reminding about the shared interest groups and especially in this do more together, I was in a meeting with them with general Caslin and it was kind of like one of those kitchen cabinet talks that you had mentioned.
And that's when they explained about the situation with women of color African-American women with their hair. And literally this was 35 years after we've had women at west point. Women entered west point in 1976, and this was in the early two thousands. And they were like, you know, the amount of time you give cadets to go to the barber shop or to the beauty salon for women is not enough for women of color.
You know, our hair takes longer and this was [00:20:00] 35 years after women were there. And it was like a light bulb went out and, um, in his head general Caslin. He's like, oh, we'll fix it. And as a result, we have. We've worked with the barbershop and beauty salon to expand hours and have sometimes, and then several times a month, have the workers come in on the weekend to accommodate because also as you indicate it, west point is a difficult challenge to get to for conferences or reunions.
There's not a lot of the beauty shops in this area that support the women of color. So it says jaw-dropping that we've had women for like 35 years here, and that did not come up even from on the tactical side, technical officer's side or other people here. And that is the importance of having the ability to have candid conversations with one another.
And you you've always been candid and transparent, especially on the board. And as you just indicated as well, we have seen our board, the diversity that increased. [00:21:00] Are there any gaps that, that you're seeing now then like a board or.
Herman Bulls: Specifically for the board. I can tell you our current chairman, Bob McDonald, Bob, obviously our listeners should know that he's the former CEO of Procter and gamble.
Bob is also the veterans affairs secretary. As a matter of fact, when Bob was a VA secretary, I actually served on the VA board. He put together a board of civilians, business people to help advise him on running the department. And Bob, let me. I think all of our chairman get it bought, gets it. I mean, he understands marketing, uh, you know, all those Proctor and gamble products that you've purchased over the years.
However, it's just not a marketing with Bob. It's his true who he is down to the bone of his heart and he understands what it takes. And I think with Bob's. Continued leadership following general different Cisco we'll go in a systematic manner looking at what are the skill. And this is the way I just left the board meeting this morning for one of [00:22:00] my boards host.
So child fortune 500 company, and we talked about succession planning and the board gaps. And there's something called a board matrix that you do. And you basically. People that you have. And then you look at what are the functional skills that are necessary from being everything from, from marketing technology, legal personnel, human resources, et cetera, et cetera.
And the idea of the board is we're not there to manage the ALG. We are there to provide governance and oversight. There's an old saying, and corporate governance is a nose in hands on. So Todd brown and his team are responsible for the day-to-day management of the organization. And our role at the board is basically two major roles.
We have number one, select the CEO and mentor him or her over the years and give them feedback. And then the second thing is really resource allocation and that determines the priorities of an organization. And we do that by approving the budget. So, and then from there. [00:23:00] The framework has been set and then it's our job to make sure that the person that we selected is making sure those strategic priorities we have agreed on are being achieved in an appropriate manner.
So we're very, very happy with the, the skills that we have on the board. We've got a great group. Uh, the new group that just came in is just off the chart. And I often say just like it is Lisa. Getting reviewed to go to the academy. I wouldn't want to compete with these kids that are going to be on the academy now.
And I'm going to tell you, our board is really the same way. It's just people, you know, we, again, we tap the cute few people on the shoulder and said, why don't you consider? And the majority of the people are just people that care about. Because again, you pay your own way, you do all this good stuff, but the feeling you get from having contributed to the wellbeing of the institution that is so precious, our nation west point is a uncompatible.
Lisa Benitez: [00:24:00] How you essentially recruited people to apply and be active. And our board and committees here at the academy, we have a program called the minority visitation program, which has really made an impact on our African-American diversity numbers. Actually, you and your family have generously contributed to that program.
Are there any other programs at west point or AOD should consider to encourage diversity and inclusion?
Herman Bulls: Indirectly we are, as I told you, in terms of the staff and faculty, but again, we walk a very tight line. Okay. On the one hand. In terms of being advocacy, being, being advocates, we have to be very, very careful.
Okay. And some of your listeners, I hope can appreciate this because again, the superintendent, none of us know, unless we've been superintendent and I've been close to a lot of them, the number of stakeholders that they have to deal with is, [00:25:00] you know, every old grad has an opinion. And most superintendents hear from a large percentage of them.
So they have to do things in a measured way. And of course, any leader, you've got a vision, you've got your standards and you've got your ethics and you're going to go forward. However, in this meantime, it's also important that you understand all of the stakeholders out there and that you're appropriately communicating with them the best you can.
So in terms of saying, you know, things that should continue to do, I think, you know, those, um, shared interest groups that we talked about, I think those are very, very important. And when Todd brown got the job as a CEO, one interesting idea, he brought to the table said that he went west point to be the most connected.
Alumni group and the world, and Todd has done an excellent job of thinking about, so if your listeners are not familiar with Sally port, okay, something they can download on your iPhone or your Android device, and you can find any [00:26:00] grad and most grads have opted to be in it. You can find any grad that's ever gone to west point and sent him an email.
And if they turn on their location, you know, a little creepy, you can actually tell where they are at the moment. So you can, so if you're a you're in San Francisco and you just want to say, oh, If they've got their phone on, you can see every west point or in the area that that is there. Uh, so programs such as that I think are certainly outside of the box and very important.
So I think if we do what we've done, Lisa, and that is we have a representative board. Okay. And we do now with women and minorities, an area that we can improve upon is Hispanic. And Asian, um, you know, Sally, Sally certainly helps us there as well. However, the point is we have a very diverse board. Then what Bob and the chairman do is create an environment.
And you can imagine coming into that room the first time, people are probably a [00:27:00] little reluctant to see. And that's what the chair and the vice chair, it's our role to make sure that everybody brings their full self to the board and that they have the ability to contribute because you're there for a person purpose, at least.
And that is to provide a perspective. And I think as we, as long as we continue to have the ability to identify those things, Some of them require resources. And for example, the visitation program or required resources and Lisa, I want to thank you publicly now for all of you did for pulling that program together.
Not only that. And one of the things that we looked at is saying, and I always tell people, I say, this is behind the doors. I said, Hey guys, we can come up and talk about all the things we want to happen for minorities. And African-Americans okay. But if you don't show that you can put some resources behind it and raise some money to make it happen.
You know, you're going to get the sympathy. Look, I don't want to sympathy. Look, I want to look because I belong at the table. And when you show that ability to bring [00:28:00] resources, you know, that enhances your ability to have a say in what goes on.
Lisa Benitez: Absolutely money makes the world around. You had mentioned one of the Aug goals of being the most connected graduate body in the world.
Know, I personally can give many examples as to why we are the most connected graduate body in the world, even before it was a. Why is this important in the DEI
Herman Bulls: world? It's very important. If you get back to it and let, let let's talk about an experience. And I just had it last six months. So I was on a plane.
I went out to the army, Wisconsin game and, uh, it's young, you know, you can always tell you, get on a plane to a little secretary and always tell the law enforcement people because they get to get on first and they get on and they talk to the pilot, right. So you're like, oh, Okay. He's an air marshal or whatever.
So this, uh, African-American lad was in front of me. I, you know, got on, get in my little seat early and the [00:29:00] gentleman said, Hey, you're Herman bulls. And I, you know, having taught there for, in essence over 20 years, that happens a lot. And I'm like, wait, you know, and then I'm in a lot of other situations. I'm like, I don't, you know, I didn't recognize him per se.
And I said, yes, I am. He said, Hey, um, my name is Brian and I got tell ya. Okay. I just love to talk to you sometime, whatever. And I went to my seat, he got in his seat and we got off the plane and he said, Hey, look, I work over at the FBI in if you'd like, yeah, I'd love to have you come over and visit. And I got to tell you, Lisa, I get I've already today gotten 10 or 15 emails, people that would just, I just want 15 minutes.
And it's just impossible to do them all, but I must admit, I do respond to them and I'm transparent in terms of a fact that if I gave everybody 15 minutes, I wouldn't have time to sleep. Uh, but in this sense, it was just something about Brian that was intriguing. And I gave him a card and he gave me his card.
And then, you know, the next day I got an email [00:30:00] from him and he was actually going to the game as well. We were flying into Chicago and he said, Hey, look, I really want to get you over to the F. And it took us about two months to do it. But about three weeks ago, I went over the FBI and I go in and kid meets me to escort me up and he says, oh yeah, I happen to be a west point grad as well.
And it was, Brian's a chief of staff and we'd go up and I knew Brian was kind of high. I'd done some research on him. And then I go up and I get in his office. And then I learned that Brian Turner is the number four person in the FBI. Okay. And I'm sitting there and we're talking and, uh, he says her, let me show you this.
And he showed me a article in a magazine from CW post, where he had gone for his graduate degree to come back to be attack at west point. And they had an entire whole page spread on. And what he was doing for our country, et cetera, et cetera. And Brian, didn't say it in a, [00:31:00] um, in a sense of, of anger, but he said, you know, it appears that CW post cares more about what I done than my own undergrad, Alma mater.
And. Okay. I said, don't worry, Brian, we're going to fix this. So long story short and Brian, you're listening to this one day. I hate putting our personal conversations out for the public, but this is for the good of the order that we're talking here and along. Sorry. Got Brian introduced to Jay. Okay. And those of you who don't know, and by the way, I want to tell you another thing we've done at AIG, our senior leadership.
Okay. I want to talk about Terrence Saintville who's African-American. He has alumni affairs. You got Christine Richardson, female, who is the chief of staff and essence to Todd. We've got Kristen Sorenson who has done a fantastic job at Lisa used to be your boss, raising money. We've got Cheryl Brooks who looks over HR.
So we are living it. We're living that diversity and having Lisa, we were sorry to [00:32:00] miss you lose you, but we're happy where you are, but in any event got him introduced to Jay Todd wrote him a note guys, number four in the FBI, and we've got this thing called combating terrorism center. And guess what? He oversees for the FBI, cyber security and terrorism.
So when Suzanne Nelson got him. Connected to them. So that's the connected alumni work work. We've got an individual here that not only for what he has done should be recognized, and he's not looking for that now. Okay. But we should do that. Okay. We should celebrate that. The other issue is what he will be able to bring back to the academy in terms of the connections that he has in Washington, DC, to support our academic programs.
We'll be phenomenal. So that's that connected? That's that connectedness. And, um, you know, and I, I told Brian, I said, you know, this goes both ways. Yes. And we found out to tell the truth and I believe in [00:33:00] transparency, we found out that we had a little glitch in our internal system at IOG. One part of AIG had heard about.
But it didn't get over to the part of the EOG that would have done something about it. And I'm happy to say that, um, Jay is gonna fix that. And that's for all graduates, not only African American graduates, we should be doing this and celebrating all graduates success. But in this instance where we're particularly trying to connect and make sure in this environment, or I'm going to call it the Rodney era, we've got to make sure that we take advantage of every opportunity to celebrate that.
Lisa Benitez: Absolutely. And like you said, things are for the good of the order and thank you for always bringing best practices, not only to the AIG, but to, to west point because they do make a difference. And that's the importance of being inclusive and, you know, listening to others. And taking that advice and putting it to, to action [00:34:00] and regarding connectedness, I mean, just the other night, you connected me with someone who is on the sec Army's team.
And she was actually here today and her father is from the class of 78. So we are really, really a connected group. And I know you, we haven't mentioned your sons, who I, who I know you're proud of two of which. Are also west point grads and who have been back here at the academy and are doing great things.
I don't know if you want to share any differences between their experiences and your experiences or any opportunities that they've had in their careers. Yeah,
Herman Bulls: well, they'll, they'll get mad at me for even talking about them, but probably the person that had the most impact on them and me for that matter.
It's my late wife, Iris, who unfortunately passed away last year. A little, a little emotional here, but she was so proud of those kids and, uh, Herman Jr. Graduated in 2005 [00:35:00] and has done a, just a fantastic job. And for tree guy, three tours in the war, and he's now working out in the army marketing office and he, he was a.
Selected, as you said, he worked in the admissions office and before going there went to duke for his MBA, then Nathaniel did not go to west point, but he's just been such a fan of army sports and army football and supporting Jonathan when he was playing. And he always keeps up with everything west point and Nathaniel went to Earlham college and he's now working for Sedexo and health care.
So he's been busy the last couple of years. And then Jonathan, you mentioned he graduated in 2011 and some of your listeners may remember he was the army punter on the team that, uh, broke the drought and not only went to a bowl game and, uh, 2010, but beat SMU for Army's first victory in a bowl and over 20 years.
So Jonathan, um, medically retired from the military after six years and he also went to duke for his MBA and he's, as we speak, we're a. Recording [00:36:00] this today, it's just before the Superbowl and Jonathan works for Microsoft and sales and he was one of five people out of the nation selected on the sales competition to get to go to the.
So he'll be leaving for the super bowl tomorrow as a result of his hard work. So he's doing a great job. So as far as their perspective, I mean, first of all, I don't even think they, they were not, they didn't grow up saying I want to go to west point. It kinda just occurred. Jonathan didn't even start the process until the second semester of his senior year.
Matter of fact, the admissions I heard later, they said, yeah, this kid doesn't really want to be here. I think he's getting a parental influence because his brother went here. His mom worked here at admissions and his dad, you know, taught here and went here. So he actually went to a civilian prep school for a year and then went to west point, just did a fantastic job, both as a cadet and the contributions he made to the army football program.
So like anything Lisa and I know speaking of kids, you got some great kids, even though you had one of them go through the navel of. Who is my adopted daughter and, and, you know, as [00:37:00] well as I do your kids mature over time and things that they would have done 20 years ago or things that they do different now, however, as we both pushed our kids to do things, I know they have an appreciation for it now.
And, uh, those kids just, just, just love west point. And they know that, you know, not only what we have given today, But what we will continue to give the west point, basically what theoretically would be their inheritance, but we feel so strongly as a family about west point. That we're very, very big supporters, not only with our time and talent, but we type there as well.
So, and that they're
Lisa Benitez: okay with it. And I definitely would be remiss and. Iris was taken from us way too soon. Um, the matriarch of your family and just a distinguished career. And so many things I found out after she left us too soon is, um, cause she was just so humble. Um, an extraordinary individual. You know, your, your life [00:38:00] partner and the two of you, the family and the sons that, that you've nurtured and, and encourage them and set them on the right path in life.
I share this with you. I'm in your home with your guests, just how much she meant to me and my family. And just such an inspiration. I do remember cause we, it was a celebration of life and we talk that reminding us to eat our vegetables, eat your broccoli and your greens eat today and to read every day and encourage you the grandkids to eat.
So we definitely want to include her that, and I know she was also part of. Your philanthropy. I mentioned it earlier about minority visitation program, but I know you support other margin of excellence programs. I was point pretty much across the board.
Herman Bulls: Yeah. There's one that we're working on now, or we're making a significant contribution because IRS, in addition to being an army officer, we, we met at Fort Dix, New Jersey.
She moved in and across the hall from me. And as they say, the rest is history, you know, she, she, uh, when I [00:39:00] was at Harvard, she was at Tufts. She was admissions officer at west point. She worked on the Bush. Well, in our world committee, she was a presidential appointee in the Clinton administration, number two person for personnel in the army.
So she had a huge job. And, uh, then after that, Um, she went and worked into defense language area. So she put together all the pipe. Matter of fact, she worked with all the academies. You know, the academies didn't want to have another language course. She was arguing they needed it because she worked on, uh, language and culture issues.
And one of the things that she and I. Discussed prior to her passing and we're going to certainly take it as that. She wanted to do something at west point, you know, I'm kind of supporting athletics and all that good stuff. She says, I want to do something around language and culture. So we have an outline now that we're need to finalize where we're going to do something in the department of foreign language, where we want to encourage black cadets to get involved in foreign language and culture and foreign affairs and those types of things, because it was very, very important to her.
And we're going to. Honor her with [00:40:00] something that will get a, you know, a few cadets off overseas, doing whatever they need to do, because she just understood the importance of that in her day job. And, uh, we will be very, very happy to, uh, have her remembered in that way. And we've, we've done some fantastic things.
Also at her Alma mater. We can't forget our HBCU. She went to undergrad at Virginia state university and we've. Made a sizable donation there as well is she started working on both of these before she passed. And you know, we're still finalized actually. We've actually finalized the language for the one at Virginia state.
And it is again for students, for people from this HBCU to be exposed to language and culture and international affairs. And I, I can't think of a more lasting thing for her to do because this lady I'm Italian, she was so you're right. She was so humble. At least I had so many people come up and tell me the same thing that you did after Iris pass.
You know, it's like, you know, [00:41:00] Iris is not Herman's husband. Herman is irises. You're in show what I'm saying, you know, it's like, you know, she was just the, the, probably the more humble of the two of us, but let me tell you, I'll tell you who wore the pants in the family. I'll tell you that you've been in our house before, so you know,
Lisa Benitez: that.
Yes, beautiful home. And, and just the, maybe you, you and your family just pay it forward. And having been in fundraising at AIG for 23 years, I understand the importance of margin of excellence. And that's the X factor here at the academy. Obviously the Academy's federally funded. But Kristen and her team just continuously raising over $50 million each year for the last like five or more years.
Now that really allows the academy to do special programs to enhance the 47 month experience. You brought
Herman Bulls: up such a great point there and what a lot of our graduates don't understand. Uh, particularly the older back they go, it's like the [00:42:00] government should be doing this or government should be doing that.
And, and I agree to some extent, uh, however, if you look at any high quality higher education institution out there, they help themselves in terms of the graduates, helping. To give back. So if, uh, one of the things that the ALG really is there for, and I think general Chrisman, we need to give a superintendent, give him the credit for coming up with this idea of the margin of excellence.
And I can remember w on the board and what we were thinking about getting Kimsey center done the first time he came through to the board. And he showed a picture of the Naval Academy's weight room. He showed one of the air force Academy's weight room, and I tell you, he didn't have to doctor it up. And he showed armies.
I mean, if you just went, you gotta be kidding me. And he kind of came up with the margin of excellence because the government will pay for those basic things that we'll get after 47 months, a cadet commissioned with the. But [00:43:00] for example, I'll never forget. My classmate, Louis caldera was secretary of the army.
And matter of fact, Iris was working for him at the time. And we were billing Arvin Jim at the time. And, you know, we had to, let's just say I did a little, you know, behind the scenes I'm here in Washington. I know a few people and making some introductions and. One of the Congressman, you know, is like, you know, you guys, you guys gotta do what other people do as well.
And what that is the core or the infrastructure, the envelope of the gym, or the gym was built with government. However, the climbing wall, all the equipment and all of those other things that was done with private money, uh, you know, coordinated by the ALG. And that's what we say, the margin of excellence.
So for example, all the cadets that go on the AI ads, the summer that, you know, in addition to CTLT cadet, troop leader, training, the government pays for that, right? Because that's helping you become a leader, but when we send them to France, I don't know how, you know, you guys were sending them to 50 different countries over [00:44:00] the summer.
All of those things, the government does not pay. In order to enrich that cadet experience that comes from donated funds and that's that margin of excellence and look at, look at what that margin of excellence did for Rhodes scholars this year to include one African-American and talk about diversity, all four of them females.
Okay. I gives me goosebumps every time I see that picture and, you know, that's what we represent is opportunity. It takes money to make things great. Just look at the Alabama football team.
Lisa Benitez: Roll tide. Yeah. And actually five of our last nine real scholars are African-American and they all started. And another margin of excellence program called the Excel program, which was actually started by a professor Dr.
Erica Rivera and the SNL and a tactical officer, Lieutenant Colonel Gatlin. And actually, he was probably like a major back then captain promotable [00:45:00] major. And they were just talking about why is it that all the scholarship winners at west point or majority cadets are white cabinets. And, um, there is a scholarship program run.
We had four women, as you said, um, earned the rose scholarship this year. But, um, they created this program to help cadets of color. And this program was started in 2012. And since its inception, we've had over 50, primarily African-American cadets earn post-graduate scholarships, mostly in the stem field actually.
And that program never would have existed if it wasn't for the creativity and the thinking the forward thinking just like, like you indicated earlier that you have Herman and, and then as you know, AOD raises money for the academy programs, with what they want. Once we got the green light from the academy, we've raised, um, funding for this excellent program, the Excel program.
And that's just one that we've talked about. Excel on our DCA clubs are also funded [00:46:00] primarily through donations.
Herman Bulls: Make sure your, your lists are still what VCA director of cadet activity.
Lisa Benitez: Yes. So that is a directorate that they have over 130 clubs for our, for our cadets, very robust. And they also manage some restaurants and, and our Eisenhower hall theater.
So they do have some revenue generation sources. They also need the funding for those 130 clubs, because as you indicated earlier, having the clubs here at west point, but this is not needed to produce a second, second Lieutenant. So that is margin of excellence to have these clubs for these activities, for our cadets to do.
I mean, there's a whole development team that manages all the needs of the academies, but if it's going on here, you know, gospel choir, national society of black engineers, they brothers big sisters did Jewish chapel
Herman Bulls: choir. I even what the academy does, I can remember back to my cadet days. And even when I was on [00:47:00] staff there, teaching, if you've looked at kind of who.
Outside speakers that were brought in there. Wasn't a lens of, are we bringing people that will inspire and promote the wellbeing of all of our cadets? It was like, okay, can we get whatever, whatever. And if the people who are making those decisions are not doing. They're going to reach to their connections and you end up with this funnel of none diversity.
And I think what the academy does now in terms of, I mean, look at who are even the fair award winner last year, African-American when win that award. And, and I think, you know, look this year, distinguished graduate, you know, we had, uh, African-American female, we had two females to start with and we also had a African-American.
So the constitution in fabric of our academy is just so. That we make sure that we're representative of everybody. I mean, everybody and, uh, you know, white males should not feel like they're excluded. You're part of this fabric [00:48:00] and you, you are represented, you will continue to be represented. However, we are the United States military academy and we exist to help defend the constitution of the United States.
Lisa Benitez: Well, Herman, thank you for your time today. Really appreciate spending time with you, even though it's virtually. And I know I, I expect to see you, um, this, this spring, when we thought out of here in New York.
Herman Bulls: Yeah. Well, look at looking, looking forward to it and at least again, I want to thank you. And, um, you know, definitely want to give a shout out to Todd brown, our CEO, because again, You know, we get excited about this as board members.
You know, we, we, we're involved more than once a quarter. However, Todd is living it every day. And I, I tell you in terms of what he has done to diversify the staff at the most senior levels to be available, to treat. Uh, to people, how he responded to this Brian issue. I mean, he [00:49:00] just got it right away and he knows because if we're successful there, we're going to get more people and we're just going to be much better off.
So I really command you and we're so happy to have you back at the academy. And, uh, in another capacity, we certainly miss you at the association of graduates, but the good news is we get to continue to work with you. And we know that you're going to continue to do great. Thank you. Herman
Narrator: OnPoint is a production of the WPA broadcast network.
Please take a moment to rate and review the show and join us each week for a new episode. Thank you for listening.