This episode of On Point features an interview with Chris Gaertner, Partner at Integrity Partners and Co-CEO and CFO of DHC Acquisition Corporation. Chris has 25+ years of experience in underwriting, advising, and mergers and acquisitions for some of the best technology companies in the world. He has been a lead advisor on over 100 equity and M&A transactions, including some of the largest deals in technology, and has led IPOs for companies such as Google and OpenTable.
This episode of On Point features an interview with Chris Gaertner, Partner at Integrity Partners and Co-CEO and CFO of DHC Acquisition Corporation.
Chris has 25+ years of experience in underwriting, advising, and mergers and acquisitions for some of the best technology companies in the world. He has been a lead advisor on over 100 equity and M&A transactions, including some of the largest deals in technology, and has led IPOs for companies such as Google and OpenTable. He holds a BS in Electrical Engineering from the United States Military Academy at West Point, an MS in Electrical Engineering from Columbia University, and an MBA from the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania. Chris served as an infantry officer in the U.S. Army with the 82nd Airborne Division, XVIII Airborne Corps, and 1st Special Operations Command.
In this episode of On Point, Chris Gaertner talks about how as a first generation American, he felt a need to serve the country. He discusses his experiences in ranger school and serving in the Army’s 82nd Airborne Division. Chris also speaks about his passion for flying and diving that has continued to this day since his time at West Point. In addition, Chris provides insight on moving from the military to civilian life, and shares advice on how to make the transition to business successful.
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“To be successful, not only in the military but also during transition out of the military to running a business, I would say that actually building your network outside of your day to day work is extremely important. And I can tell you it takes effort, but you get so much leverage from it that it pays back dividends very, very quickly." - Chris Gaertner
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(02:15) Segment 1: AAR
(02:39) Chris’ experience at West Point
(03:41) Handling flying and diving on top of everything at West Point
(04:56) Other activities at West Point
(04:03) Advice from Chris’ personal experience
(06:15) Chris’ West Point mentors
(08:08) Why Chris branched Infantry and 82nd
(08:52) Chris’ Army experience
(11:08) Why Chris decided to transition from the Army
(12:11) Segment 2: Sit Rep
(13:30) Going to business school
(13:48) Why investment banking?
(16:41) Chris’ most memorable transaction experiences
(20:38) Transitioning into investment banking
(23:05) Focusing on mobility, infrastructure and digital security at Integrity
(25:47) Segment 3: The SOP
(29:47) Daily work-life balance
(31:51) Piloting his own plane
(33:34) Leadership principles
(36:38) Segment 4: Giving Back
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West Point Association of Graduates
[00:00:00] Narrator: Hello and welcome to On Point.
This episode features an interview with Chris Gaertner, Partner at Integrity Partners and Co-CEO and CFO of DHC Acquisition Corporation.
Chris has 25+ years of experience in underwriting, advising, and mergers and acquisitions for some of the best technology companies in the world. He has been a lead advisor on over 100 equity and M&A transactions, including some of the largest deals in technology, and has led IPOs for companies such as Google and OpenTable. He holds a BS in Electrical Engineering from the United States Military Academy at West Point, an MS in Electrical Engineering from Columbia University, and an MBA from the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania. Chris served as an infantry officer in the U.S. Army with the 82nd Airborne Division, the XVIII (18) Airborne Corps, and 1st Special Operations Command.
In this episode of On Point, Chris Gaertner talks about how as a first generation American, he felt a need to serve the country. He discusses his experiences in ranger school and serving in the Army’s 82nd Airborne Division. Chris also speaks about his passion for flying and diving that has continued to this day since his time at West Point. In addition, Chris provides insight on moving from the military to civilian life, and shares advice on how to make the transition to business successful.
Now-please enjoy this interview between Chris Gaertner and your hosts, Tim Hsia and Lance Dietz.
[00:01:38] Tim Hsia: Welcome to OnPoint. I'm Tim Shaw, class of 2004, and I'm Lance
[00:01:42] Lance Dietz: Dietz class of 2008.
[00:01:44] Tim Hsia: And today we're joined by Chris Gaertner class of 1984, Chris. Doing great. Thank you. Awesome. Thanks for making time for us. Let's get into our first segment AR or for our non-military listeners after action review. In this segment, we'd like to touch on [00:02:00] specifically what other veterans can learn from you, your process and your journey.
[00:02:03] Tim Hsia: Chris, could you please talk about your decision to attend west point and what you gained from that?
[00:02:09] Chris Gaertner: Sure. So maybe a little bit of background on the first generation American. My parents came over from Europe after world war II. And when I was a little kid, they basically had me traveling around the world and seeing all different types of countries.
[00:02:22] Chris Gaertner: And we had relatives behind the iron curtain and candidly, I really didn't have a choice. I mean, it sort of felt that he needed to serve this country and felt really blessed to be. So at a very early age, I felt that, uh, I was going to west point. How
[00:02:37] Tim Hsia: was your experience at west point?
[00:02:39] Chris Gaertner: I loved west point.
[00:02:40] Chris Gaertner: I have to say, I mean, don't get me wrong. There were certainly challenges. There were certainly times when I felt did I make the right choice, especially during midterms or finals, but overall I love the academy and it was because obviously the people that I was surrounded with, they were very like-minded, uh, challenging themselves, always looking to better them.
[00:02:59] Chris Gaertner: And doing it for a [00:03:00] higher cause I don't think I could've found a better group to really be around. And secondly, the academy really let me follow every passion that I had. I was able to become a private pilot. I wanted to fly ever since I was a little kid also. So I, for $10 an hour, I was renting an airplane and flying around and became a scuba instructor when I was there as well.
[00:03:21] Chris Gaertner: So something I still do today. Continue to certify people on my vacation. So it's, it's something I've continued to do as along with flying. So it was really a place that I felt I could.
[00:03:34] Tim Hsia: Amazing. I barely survived west point and didn't do flying or scuba. How did you manage to handle everything?
[00:03:41] Chris Gaertner: I think it was a matter of just time discipline.
[00:03:45] Chris Gaertner: I think that's one of the biggest lessons you learned from the military is you can manage your time very effectively. You're getting through your meals in what, 30 seconds. It just makes it a lot easier to get on with the rest of your day, if you're just organized. And it's something that I didn't really think about.[00:04:00]
[00:04:00] Chris Gaertner: And you just naturally absorb how quickly you need to do things where you spend your time focus on what matters and then move on to the next topic. So I felt in terms of the military, that was one of the big lessons. The other being just the ability to work with. When I got out of the military, that was one thing I was new.
[00:04:18] Chris Gaertner: I might not be the smartest guy, but I always knew I could work harder than everybody
[00:04:21] Tim Hsia: else. Working hard as a common theme amongst the speakers we have, perhaps the most universal theme, the
[00:04:27] Chris Gaertner: one thing you can control you're there's only so many variables you can control. And I knew, okay, look. I know I can get along on almost no sleep, almost no food.
[00:04:35] Chris Gaertner: I don't need to be warm. I need very little to support. And at the end of the day, that seems to win the contest many times. Uh,
[00:04:42] Tim Hsia: I'm sure Tom's involved and saw that you were an electrical engineer juice major, so juice, major scuba pilot. What other activities did you do
[00:04:51] Chris Gaertner: at west point? Uh, it was on the marathon team.
[00:04:53] Chris Gaertner: Also. I ran track with coach Bazell. He taught me that pain was something. Yeah, you just got used to in [00:05:00] terms of running. And I have to say between track and then the marathon team putting in miles at the academy, just running and running really prepared me for every school that came out. Ranger school. I have to say physically now I got hurt during ranger school.
[00:05:15] Chris Gaertner: I got a stick in my eye in Florida, so I recycled. But as far as the physical nature of jump master airborne, that jump master password. I never found anything physically difficult because there was so much running involved and I really didn't feel I was getting pushed. I mean, don't get me wrong. It was there.
[00:05:30] Chris Gaertner: Yeah, it was difficult. But from the standpoint of preparation, I felt I was in pretty good. So
[00:05:35] Tim Hsia: Westpoint, um, work ethics, one thing managing time is another. And I'm curious if there were any other themes or mentors that you got from west point?
[00:05:45] Chris Gaertner: Yeah. A couple of things that I thought were pretty important, the first is, and this, this is almost a bit of a disadvantage at times is, uh, having been in banking for many years, interacting with.
[00:05:55] Chris Gaertner: Very prominent CEOs. The one thing that I found on the military side, the military [00:06:00] CEOs who I've seen and done business with is that they're very self-aware and it almost becomes limiting because they recognize their own shortcomings. And perhaps don't put themselves out there as much as some other CEOs who are not, self-aware not nearly as capable, but just don't know what they don't know and don't know their own limitations.
[00:06:18] Chris Gaertner: So at times I feel like the military can actually be a disadvantage in terms of people being able to get to that next level. We all look at ourselves and say, Hey, am I really prepared? Do I really want to raise my hand and say, I'm the guy for this? When in reality that everybody else is much less qualified, but much quicker to put up their hand and say that they're the one that should be selected.
[00:06:38] Chris Gaertner: The other piece that I would just say is that a lot of times west pointers are trained. Force, you know, go right through the wall and just put your head down, smashed against it until it breaks. And that can work at times, but there's also times when you just want to say, wait a minute, let me just see if I can walk around this.
[00:06:53] Chris Gaertner: And again, the military has proven that, okay. If I put my head down, I know I can get through anything. And [00:07:00] sometimes there's an easier way to do it.
[00:07:02] Tim Hsia: Fascinating. Thank you. Were there any mentors or close friends that really helped you through the Westpoint
[00:07:07] Chris Gaertner: journey? I had some classmates that even today are just absolutely spectacular people.
[00:07:13] Chris Gaertner: I had my marathon coach. Colonel Hansen was a big inspiration again, Mr. Vicks on from scuba diving, he really helped me, I think, just focus on some things that were outside of the military, but at the same time, I guess very synergistic with what we're doing in the military. So yeah, the answer is, as I said, you're surrounded by few individuals that perhaps stick out.
[00:07:35] Chris Gaertner: And looking at west point, it was really everybody, you know, the leadership. I think there were times where I felt well, am I ever going to be able to measure up to that? The legacy that the people before me at west point, and just trying to hold myself to that standard was a real challenge.
[00:07:50] Tim Hsia: You talked about ranger school and jump master being relatively easy.
[00:07:54] Tim Hsia: Could you talk about why you branch infantry and 82nd? Well,
[00:07:58] Chris Gaertner: I would say I don't want to be [00:08:00] quoted as saying. Jump faster. We're easier. I would say that from a physical standpoint running, we made it easier. But the cold, because I went to winter ranger as to say, I had no idea how cold individual can actually get.
[00:08:13] Chris Gaertner: And then it was about around that time when we had, unfortunately somebody passed away from hypothermia and the class, so it was cold. It was really cold. And what I learned from ranger school was, again, the biggest lessons are sort of look at yourself and say, all right, Everyone wants to think that they're hard and they're tough and they can push through things, but it's not until you really find your physical limitations and you have to look at yourself and then look, you know, that commitment to others on your team to push to the next one.
[00:08:43] Chris Gaertner: And I felt that that is something. And again, the invaluable lesson from ranger school, it wasn't the ability to March it wasn't rocking. It wasn't land nav. Wasn't knowing how to tile, the different knots, uh, throw them all talk, talk. It wasn't any of that stuff. That was fun. It was really okay. I am dead tired [00:09:00] and somebody got to carry the and the tripod and everybody's hurting.
[00:09:05] Chris Gaertner: Let's figure out which guys are going to stick up their hand and really pull through for everybody. And you just learned a lot about yourself and learned about other people.
[00:09:14] Tim Hsia: Last ranger school question, were you a hungry ranger or sleepy ranger?
[00:09:18] Chris Gaertner: I was a hungry ranger. I, for whatever reason, the sleep didn't bother me that much, but, well, I was in there looking for any scrap that you could possibly find trash cans everywhere.
[00:09:30] Chris Gaertner: We were looking for it everywhere.
[00:09:33] Tim Hsia: And could you talk about your army experience and what was it like? 82nd, as I mentioned,
[00:09:37] Chris Gaertner: west point for me was sort of a great experience in terms of just the opportunities and all the things that we learned. And when we got to the army. It was a bit of a different situation simply because now we were with the troops, you were managing a set of individuals that perhaps didn't hold themselves to the same standard as many of the officers that we've been used to [00:10:00] dealing with.
[00:10:00] Chris Gaertner: So it was a little bit of an adjustment in that regard. And as far as managing people, I probably learned a lot more from managing soldiers in 82nd than I did. Prior to that at west point, you just can't learn that that's something you have to sit in front of. And enlisted person and figure out what motivates them and make sure you're pushing all the right buttons to get the tasks at hand done.
[00:10:24] Chris Gaertner: It was very different than what I expected. You had to not only give the order, but you also had to make sure that it was followed up on and ensure that it was done in the right way. So there was just a lot of checks and balances that perhaps were a little bit less efficient than what I thought I was going to experience in the army.
[00:10:39] Chris Gaertner: Loved the troops really got along with them again. I think there's a big difference between. Peace time and war time. Officers and soldiers. And I think you just have to learn how to manage either one effectively. And
[00:10:53] Tim Hsia: what led to your decision to transition
[00:10:55] Chris Gaertner: from the army? My father was, I mentioned he came over from Europe.
[00:10:57] Chris Gaertner: He is part of the brain drain after world war [00:11:00] II found that a research development company and he had a heart attack. Unexpectedly. So I felt that it was important for me to, well, didn't really have an option needed to get and help run the family business. So we were developing custom computer systems primarily for the department of defense.
[00:11:17] Chris Gaertner: And while I really enjoyed being an infantry officer, My father had previously convinced me that ultimately technology's going to matter in future battles and developing next generation systems and being part of that was vital. And I just thought it was going to be a few years down the road when I was doing that, not so soon.
[00:11:35] Chris Gaertner: So he had a heart attack. I started running the family business and built that into a company that we ultimately sold the general. Awesome.
[00:11:44] Lance Dietz: Chris, we're going to transition here to the next segment, the sit rep or the situation report. And this is where we dive into kind of what you're doing now and the path that you had after the voluntary.
[00:11:54] Lance Dietz: You just alluded to it, but you've had a long career in finance. And I'm curious, kind of when you were [00:12:00] at west point, even in the military, was that a career that you were thinking about and specifically going into the investment bank? Not
[00:12:08] Chris Gaertner: at all. I heard about investment banking, but I never thought that that was gonna be my path.
[00:12:12] Chris Gaertner: I really thought I was going to be an infantry officer, but number of years down the road, my father would tell me he wanted to retire and then I would join the family business and ultimately take that over. But all of that was accelerated. And what happened was he fortunately left us with some very interesting designs that I was able to execute on and develop some proprietary technology that all of the.
[00:12:34] Chris Gaertner: Prime contractors wanted to incorporate into their various bids for the midlife F 16 updates and the European fighter aircraft. And they decided to come and make offers to buy the business. So that's ultimately why I went from soldier to running this business to then selling it much quicker than I had anticipated.
[00:12:57] Lance Dietz: And then following that is that when you went to business school and then [00:13:00] got on the investment banking, um,
[00:13:02] Chris Gaertner: Yeah. So even when I sold the business, I ran the vision for them for a couple of years and felt that I wanted to do something a little bit different. And while I enjoyed the technology quite a bit, I didn't enjoy the day-to-day management.
[00:13:17] Chris Gaertner: And I felt being able to step back and sort of look around a little bit, having time to do that would be helpful. And that was the reason for going to business. So I also felt okay if I'm going to business school, I should go to address an area where I felt a weakness and that was finance because I was very technically oriented.
[00:13:37] Chris Gaertner: And I just remember doing my own deal. Just understanding all the bits and pieces and valuation was something that no, I didn't hire a banker. I just did it myself, which looking back was probably a mistake, but it was something that I felt I needed to. Get up to speed on and enjoyed it while I did it. So that was the reason for the MBA.
[00:13:56] Chris Gaertner: And before I even finished my MBA, I applied to Columbia for a double a [00:14:00] master's in engineering, because I didn't know if I was going to go back to running a business or if I was going to try to make my way to do something else.
[00:14:09] Lance Dietz: Yeah, no, it's fascinating. I mean, you then went on to have a incredibly successful career in investment banking, managing director.
[00:14:19] Lance Dietz: Top firms, bank of America, credit Swiss. And then I think global head at Rothschild and just curious, investment banking has quite a bit of attrition, especially in the early years. Super curious, kind of what kept you in that career field? Um, For that long,
[00:14:38] Chris Gaertner: I was able to marry two things that I really enjoyed the technology, uh, being able to deal with technology companies and at the same time finance, because it really boiled down to numbers.
[00:14:47] Chris Gaertner: And so we were able to interact with the who's who, of the technology universe and the people that you, again, the challenges of really figuring out, [00:15:00] okay, what is the trend? That's going to take place over the next 10 years and how to position yourself in front of that trend and which companies should you be targeting in terms of trying to do business and advise them, and then create a roadmap for those businesses, not only capital markets, but also on the M and a side, so they can realize that vision themselves.
[00:15:20] Chris Gaertner: And I really enjoyed that work. So I would say it was very different than the military with regards to the day-to-day operations. But incredibly long hours, which is something, as I said, never really bothered me. And also working with highly motivated individuals and small teams, which was, again, something that I took back from my military experience is something that I really enjoyed.
[00:15:45] Chris Gaertner: So I would say that while there are some differences, obviously day to day, the fundamental of doing something you enjoy with people who are motivated to get the mission accomplished was very.
[00:15:58] Lance Dietz: Were there any particular [00:16:00] like companies or transactions that you look back now and just can't believe that you had the opportunity to work on or advise that that particular company or that transaction, that sticks with you today?
[00:16:11] Chris Gaertner: Well, actually, there's a number of them on every transaction that I worked on, I felt I was lucky to be part of Google's IPO was, was a big one. I was a lead banker for web lead banks that worked with them at the time. And we did something very different in terms of the IPO using a modified Dutch auction, as opposed to a digital traditional IPO.
[00:16:31] Chris Gaertner: And that whole experience was IO. That's also one of the reasons why ultimately thought doing a spec made a lot of sense. And then working with Jeff Jordan on open table, you know, after the financial crisis markets were in turmoil and at the same time we felt, Hey, look, this is a business that's different enough that we can reopen the market.
[00:16:50] Chris Gaertner: So that was quite interesting at the time largest software technology deal with Symantec, working with John Thompson, who was the CEO of Symantec. That was incredibly [00:17:00] fascinating because he's gifted in terms of his ability to lead the people. And I actually took a lot away from that transaction. Almost felt I should have been paying him during that time, just listening to how he has command of the business and command of capital markets, which was fascinating time.
[00:17:16] Chris Gaertner: And then more recently working with a company called essence, actually in case. Transformative online retail. So again, there's, there's a number of businesses that I've worked with over the years that I look at the CEOs and say, wow, you know, almost want to thank them because I walked away with these people are exceptionally bright built, tremendous teams, but at the same time, recognize that they can't do it all.
[00:17:40] Chris Gaertner: And as a result, surround themselves with appropriate advisers appropriate staff. And I think that's why we get the job done so effectively.
[00:17:47] Lance Dietz: And it had to be incredible to work with Google at that time. One thing that Tim alluded to. Earlier on was around mentors at west point in the military, as you were building this career in finance, were there any [00:18:00] particular mentors that were very close to you and had a big impact in
[00:18:03] Chris Gaertner: your career?
[00:18:04] Chris Gaertner: No. I hate to say that's one thing that I've probably felt I did very poorly, uh, up until recently is my west point and just overall network of people that I could just bounce ideas off of. And look, don't get me wrong. I would say throughout my career, I've asked people. Insight, but I always felt a little bit guilty about going and using people's time.
[00:18:27] Chris Gaertner: As you can imagine, the CEO's that you're dealing with or the people you're dealing with are extremely busy and they didn't want to feel as though I was taking them away from their job. Number one, which was running their business. So now looking back, I would say that to be successful, not only in the military, but also during transitions.
[00:18:43] Chris Gaertner: Out of the military to running a business. I would say that actually building your network outside of your day-to-day work is extremely important. And I can tell you it takes effort, but you get [00:19:00] so much leverage from. That it pays back dividends very, very quickly. And that was the one thing that I would say I had a little bit of disconnect with.
[00:19:09] Chris Gaertner: Cause it, west point it was about me being all that I could be right. Being the best person, honing yourself, making yourself as sharp as possible and not relying on others as much. And again, that was. My own personal mistake. I think I made there, but I carried that through many, many years. And looking back, I would say that my big advice is, Hey, look, build your network, leverage people that you know, can be helpful and obviously be respectful.
[00:19:37] Chris Gaertner: But at the same time, build those networks because they can be extremely powerful.
[00:19:41] Lance Dietz: And that's super helpful advice in terms of what you're doing now. Like you recently went to more of the investment side of the house. I think we'd love to hear more about that transition and what you're focused on.
[00:19:51] Chris Gaertner: A number of years ago, as you mentioned, investment banking chews up a lot of people, but I enjoyed it and it's natural for a lot of people to go from the sell side to the buy side.[00:20:00]
[00:20:00] Chris Gaertner: I didn't get the memo till later in life that I needed to move over. I should move over and I just started coming across more and more opportunities. And as I saw these opportunities, I was thinking to myself, you know, I'm sending a lot of work to the PE firms and which is great. And I had a lot of friends there, but.
[00:20:16] Chris Gaertner: There's actually a situations where I think I could add value to these companies directly. And so I always felt a little bit, okay. I'm effectively collecting a toll for connecting the pieces. But I'd like to be more involved with the companies after the deal is done. I started to think that maybe it was time for me to transition.
[00:20:35] Chris Gaertner: So that's why I started running into a few people that just happened to be west pointers. I mean, that's the funny thing as I was making this transition in my head about, all right, who should I talk to? Uh, Jerry pulling together, all the pieces. Every one of them started turning up to be a west pointer and it didn't start out that way.
[00:20:54] Chris Gaertner: When we started forming DHC, we said, here are the capabilities we need. And then the [00:21:00] network, as it started developing it all boiled down to previous grads. I would say that we've been very happy with the results. I could talk more about why, but it's one of those things where when you get to a point in life and you say, look, I really want to focus on things that make a difference.
[00:21:15] Chris Gaertner: And I want to do it with people that I know I can trust. It became pretty clear that the names that were falling in front of us had that show. Common
[00:21:24] Lance Dietz: background. Yeah. I think that's also something here with this podcast, actually, that we're trying to facilitate as well as like highlighting what other grads are doing so that maybe it's not as random when you find another grad in this space and you just happen to work, you know, together, but rather it's part of the collective community.
[00:21:42] Lance Dietz: I'd say that. That's amazing to hear. I recall going to the integrity website and being. Amazed at the number of west pointers there and was super curious to hear if it was by happenstance, which it sounds like it was, or if it was something that you focused on. I'd love to dive a little bit more into that now, in terms of where you all are [00:22:00] focused with mobility infrastructure, as well as digital security, how did you guys land on those sectors and where you focus
[00:22:07] Chris Gaertner: now?
[00:22:08] Chris Gaertner: I say that one thing that was very important to us as we started pulling this together, as we wanted to do something that mattered. You know, you reach a point in your career where you sell to look back at the body of your work and you feel good about what you've done, that it made a difference. But now we all sat down and said, we can obviously focus on a number of companies that can certainly make money and provide decent returns, but does it really matter?
[00:22:30] Chris Gaertner: Grading emojis that are that much more exciting might provide some returns, but really, it doesn't matter. I apologize to anybody who makes emojis, but when we said what does matter, and it was very clear that the nation runs on and is protected by various things. And in terms of infrastructure, we've heard that many times.
[00:22:51] Chris Gaertner: So we felt we needed to address some of the shortcomings there. So we focused on mobile. And obviously the transfer of goods and [00:23:00] services is important to keep the economy humming. And then on the flip side to keeping it safe and secure, Moves from one spot to another, uh, protecting the country is important to us.
[00:23:11] Chris Gaertner: So we we've got a fairly broad mandate with regards to, uh, mobility and then security. I would say that there's literally thousands of companies that we can work with at the same time. The ones that we've identified. Can I actually make a difference in can
[00:23:27] Lance Dietz: matter. That's very crucial. One last question, before we move on to like our next segment in terms of being on the investment side now, and working with companies in that capacity versus on the advisory side, is there one you particularly have a stronger affinity for
[00:23:45] Chris Gaertner: at this point?
[00:23:46] Chris Gaertner: The issue that we're dealing with is that most of the companies that we're investing in, we're also doing. And by that, I mean, we want to roll up our sleeves and while we're making the decision of putting capital behind something, [00:24:00] we want to make sure that we're aligned with regards to the future roadmap.
[00:24:03] Chris Gaertner: We don't want to be a spreadsheet organization. We don't want to simply put in capital and then think that our job is done. I'm very happy with the companies that we're working with. Recognize that value add. And as a result we sort of can make. Our strengths along with our.
[00:24:21] Tim Hsia: Great. Thank you. We're going to move on to our third segment, the SOP or standard operating procedure.
[00:24:26] Tim Hsia: And this segment, we're going to talk about the personal routines, habits and words to live by, to have been instrumental to your success first and foremost, what's your typical day and week like and how would you structure it? I would
[00:24:37] Chris Gaertner: say that that's probably the hardest thing to pin down is what's typical.
[00:24:40] Chris Gaertner: Uh, there are certain habits that I think I've formed over the years that have been very beneficial. One of them is working out every day. I probably work out too much, but it's important for me to make sure that I have a fair amount of physical exercise on a daily basis. And that has really helped. I guess get through [00:25:00] stressful times and pulls you away far enough from the work that you can actually see through and solve problems while doing that.
[00:25:09] Chris Gaertner: So it's very important. Is your personal health and tied with that as nutrition? I think that it's important to treat yourself like an athlete regardless of your. Because if you want to win in this business, you've got to be physically fit. And just the mental pressure that you're going to put yourself under is enormous.
[00:25:29] Chris Gaertner: If you want to play in the game and you want to be at the, at the top of the game, you have to act like it. And that goes for her body. Those are two things that I think are fairly important as nutrition and exercise, just to make sure that physically you're prepared and then mentally, I think it's constant challenge.
[00:25:46] Chris Gaertner: You want to make sure that you're always pushing yourself mentally. You can get into a rut very easily. In most professions. One of the reasons I felt I needed to change jobs after five or seven years and just moved to [00:26:00] another firm was I felt okay. I've learned enough at this place, no longer challenged in terms of what I'm facing.
[00:26:07] Chris Gaertner: And those organizations were great, but you sort of reach a point where I felt I needed to change in order to grow. And without that constant mental pushing, it would have been, I think, a much shorter career in investment banking. The one final point I would add is that I mentioned before flying and scuba diving those activities also keep me on my toes.
[00:26:31] Chris Gaertner: Now I think in my 40th year of flying and continue to fly myself for business around the world, that also it's different enough from my day job that it's relaxing, but it's also in and of itself. Very challenging because you can't make mistakes and flying in and of itself is not tolerant of lackadaisical attitude.
[00:26:52] Chris Gaertner: So it forces me to be prepared and approach it with the same level of professionalism that I approach my day. [00:27:00]
[00:27:00] Tim Hsia: A few things on riffing off what you said. This podcast episode is giving me flashbacks of both Ben falls and general standard crystals. All three of you are quite zealous about, uh, physical fitness and also about nutrition.
[00:27:15] Tim Hsia: It almost feels like there should be a DPE approved podcast given how you all really touch on that point. And then sounds like flying. Give you also a insider's advantage in terms of being able to get to one place to another very fast? Well, there were
[00:27:29] Chris Gaertner: a couple situations where I did win deals because I showed up in person before other people could even get on their commercial flight.
[00:27:34] Chris Gaertner: But those were few and far between the reality is flying is one of those things you just can't fake. You can't lie to mother nature. You can't kid yourself. So it gets back to that cell phone. And when do you know what you're capable of and you know, your limitations, it can be extremely enjoyable. And at the same time, very, very productive in terms of just being able to cover a lot of ground in very short periods.
[00:27:57] Chris Gaertner: So, as I said, flying learned at west point, [00:28:00] and there was one of those skillsets that I just continued to build on over the years
in
[00:28:04] Tim Hsia: terms of work-wise. Can you talk about what the typical week and day is like? And again, it's atypical, but just getting a semblance for how you might structure your day between meetings or between the two companies you work with.
[00:28:16] Tim Hsia: Sure.
[00:28:17] Chris Gaertner: As I said every day involves some sort of physical exercise and that usually bends to when I have meetings, but you always make sure that you have a certain block of time that you can devote to that it was different before COVID versus post COVID prior to COVID. The video calls were few and far in between because it almost shows.
[00:28:37] Chris Gaertner: That you weren't willing to put the effort in if you just went with a conference call. So if that's what your pitch was, if that's how you were presenting yourself, you knew you were at a distinct disadvantage to somebody who showed up. Now that's a little bit different, but when I was doing meetings, I would try to do two meetings a day in person.
[00:28:54] Chris Gaertner: If it was here on the panel, Sometimes three, but then it was again, a little bit challenging. Cause it's hard to be at [00:29:00] your best for three meetings, two meetings you could usually pull off now in a world of zoom, I have typically five meetings a day and those last anywhere between 30 minutes and an hour.
[00:29:12] Chris Gaertner: Again, much more efficient in terms of time being able to really get to the point and I guess spend more time on business versus just the normal pleasantries. So I would say that the overall level of productivity has gone up, but the interaction has become a little bit more difficult in terms of personal interaction on these, on these zoom calls.
[00:29:34] Chris Gaertner: So if I have five calls a day, I would say that that's fairly typical. You know, you get up early in the morning, you try to get your workouts in. I don't think that's any different than what anybody else is doing. I would say the only piece that I've probably working on now is the in-person meetings.
[00:29:51] Chris Gaertner: Again, I just spent a couple of days with the business that we're looking at and I'm doing that. I would say one to two days a week now [00:30:00] flying to Texas or some other place to have in-person meetings. I've
[00:30:04] Tim Hsia: got to ask this simply because Vance and I might try to take up flying at this recording. What's the percent of flights you fly yourself and what's the percent you just take on a Delta, Alaska United.
[00:30:16] Tim Hsia: I would say it's a hundred
[00:30:17] Chris Gaertner: percent flying myself.
[00:30:18] Tim Hsia: I'm guessing you're able to just figure out what the local airport is that you can fly. There's
[00:30:24] Chris Gaertner: thousands of airports that aren't served by the commercial airlines. And so, yeah, it's very, very easy. And the software that's available today to help you through all of that, it makes it really easy.
[00:30:33] Chris Gaertner: It's something you have to commit yourself to. You can't take it as a hobby. It's really gotta be something that you're passionate about. But as I said, it's been an incredible tool that to help me over the years, both personally and
[00:30:45] Tim Hsia: professionally, we talked about it before the recording. Brought this up, but these days you run both the venture fund and a spec in terms of time spent between the two and time and effort.
[00:30:57] Tim Hsia: Very fluid. I think you said it's roughly [00:31:00] 50, 50.
[00:31:01] Chris Gaertner: Oh, that's correct. I mean right now, but at any particular day, You're going to be spending a hundred percent of one day on a direct investing. And another day you'll be spending 75 on this back, and there's no clean way to divide it up. It really is, depending on who's calling that day, what meetings you have set up and what's demands the time and attention at that particular point.
[00:31:24] Chris Gaertner: Totally.
[00:31:24] Tim Hsia: And it feels very much like there's synergies between.
[00:31:29] Chris Gaertner: There certainly is. I mean, obviously anything that's not ready for public markets is something that we look at privately and right now the public markets are on hold. So there's just a lot more to do on the private
[00:31:38] Tim Hsia: side in the SOP. And we talked about Abbotts.
[00:31:41] Tim Hsia: How about any words or themes or leadership principles that you follow?
[00:31:48] Chris Gaertner: Well, the one thing I would say that. Has made a big difference in my life more recently, is that throughout your career, you spend time. Like one of the disadvantages, again, we have from west point is that we're surrounding ourselves [00:32:00] with people with high integrity.
[00:32:01] Chris Gaertner: And when you get out into the real world, that's just not the case. And it's a hard lesson to learn. And I came very close in a couple of situations with people who are incredibly honest, And although he got caught, uh, unfortunately never did business with them, but you know, you read about them later and you sort of get the sense, wow, this person, they just lied.
[00:32:20] Chris Gaertner: They just straight up lied and with a straight face. And they were just trying to do bad things in terms of bad deal or just things that weren't right. So you have to understand that when you come out of west point, you have this attitude that maybe everybody's like this, and the reality is it's not. So when we started from.
[00:32:39] Chris Gaertner: That's back. And then our investment vehicle, we said, look, we only want to deal with people that we can trust. And again, that is why, because if you do that, The amount of friction and any sort of transaction and any sort of dialogue goes down dramatically. If I want to do a deal with you, I've got to bring in a ton of attorneys and look over [00:33:00] my shoulder every minute to make sure that things are happening the way that you said they were going to.
[00:33:04] Chris Gaertner: That's just incredibly inefficient as opposed to working with people that, Hey, look, when you tell me you're going to do something or you tell me something to get done, I know what's going to happen. It's just a very. Way to conduct business. And so that's sort of where we are now. You know, we only really want to do business with people we can trust and people who have proven that they're trusting.
[00:33:22] Tim Hsia: That ties on to a couple of themes, both military, and what other podcast guests have said on the friction note, military history of Clausewitz, uh, friction, just abounds everywhere. And then the second is especially McCaffrey and McChrystal talked about trust, being the currency of the realm and how trust just makes everything so much faster.
[00:33:39] Tim Hsia: It
[00:33:39] Chris Gaertner: does. And it's also, unfortunately, it's one of those things that people tend to abuse. You know, they say, trust me. And as soon as somebody says that you almost know that you can't. But I think people's actions speak much louder than their words and their backgrounds. Once you understand what a person has done, you can very quickly come to the termination as to whether or not they should be part of your team
[00:33:57] Tim Hsia: or not recently, I've heard this quote [00:34:00] a few times and it's really resonated is that trust is collected in drops and then lost in buckets.
[00:34:05] Tim Hsia: I think that's very
[00:34:06] Chris Gaertner: true. That's obviously a word of caution to all of us that we have to treat every interaction with people that we value very carefully. Never assume that. People heard you properly always double-check because those misunderstandings, even if people are well-intentioned can really destroy reputations.
[00:34:24] Chris Gaertner: And it's again, being from west point, I feel as though it's doubly important because what we do not only reflects on us, but in every other classmate for the past 200 years, it's very important that we do justice for the sacrifices and all that they've done for the.
[00:34:38] Lance Dietz: So Chris, we're going to transition into our last segment here.
[00:34:41] Lance Dietz: And this is generally where we end the podcast with a final question. And the final segment is called giving back. Essentially a big part of this podcast is for those that are transitioning from the military or different parts in their career. And like, if you could go back, if you know, Chris was graduating [00:35:00] now or was leaving the military, is there any particular.
[00:35:04] Lance Dietz: Advice. I know this podcast is actually full of a lot of nuggets of wisdom, but is there anything else that, for someone that is kind of just getting started today in this market, like any sets of principles or advice that you might have for
[00:35:16] Chris Gaertner: them? The one thing I would say, and unfortunately, if people find this out the hard way is that people, when people say thank you for your service, that's basically all that.
[00:35:25] Chris Gaertner: They won't. Do you any favors after that? So don't expect people just because you served in the military, just because you sacrificed, just because you really did a job that they weren't willing or unable to do that they feel as though they owe you something. And that's just not the. We have to understand that the way you make it is going to be on your own.
[00:35:44] Chris Gaertner: And people do not feel as though they are going to help you along the way. And I know that sounds pretty brutal, but if that's the attitude that you have and you understanding that you have, it makes it much easier for the transition, know that you were a soldier. No, that you built a lot of relationships [00:36:00] and fine tune your own skillsets, but as you get to the civilian world, it's very different skillsets, very different people, and you have to learn how to adapt.
[00:36:09] Chris Gaertner: Don't keep on talking about what you did in the military and expect people to appreciate that learn. What's important to achieve your own goals and that civilian world. And that's what you have to become. Again, there's lots of useful skills that will translate, but you start talking about, Hey, when I was in the desert or when I was in ranger school or when I was in the military battle, last one conversation before people realize, okay, this person's just not transitioning to the civilian.
[00:36:33] Chris Gaertner: Take those lessons that you learned to embody them, but don't keep on reminding people about them because they honestly, many times don't care, super helpful.
[00:36:41] Lance Dietz: Um, unfortunately, Chris, that's all we have time for really appreciate you carving out some time here and chatting with Tim and I, but before I let you go, um, and I know you are a runner, but who do you have winning the big tournament of March?
[00:36:56] Chris Gaertner: At St Peter's no, I'm just kidding.[00:37:00]
[00:37:00] Chris Gaertner: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. That would, it could make quite a bit of money off that one. So I was like the one that was, I know it's a long shot, but I'm probably going to be feeling those again. This year
[00:37:08] Lance Dietz: fingers
[00:37:08] Tim Hsia: crossed. I have one more question, which is, you talked about meetings. Is this your fifth meeting of the day, or is this your sixth meeting of the day?
[00:37:15] Chris Gaertner: This is number six.
[00:37:18] Tim Hsia: Amazing. Um, Chris, Lance, thank you also very much. Thank you guys.
[00:37:24] Narrator: Um, point is a production of the WPA O G broadcast network. Please take a moment to rate and review the show and join us each week for a new episode. Thank you for listening.