David discusses what it takes to work a full-time job and run an impactful charity, why you shouldn’t try to be all things to all people, and how to keep the same level of satisfaction and camaraderie in your post-service life.
“You're never going to be able to scratch that itch, that service, and comradeship that we got that satisfaction from while in uniform. So if that's important to you, then find a way to keep that alive. Fallen Patriots is my calling from that perspective. I think that's important to almost all veterans is to keep that sense of purpose and service alive.” — David Kim
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Episode Timestamps:
*(2:12) - Why David went to West Point
*(6:20) - Jumping headfirst into the private equity world
*(17:15) - How David thinks about career progression
*(20:40) - The founding story behind Children of Fallen Patriots Foundation
*(22:00) - The success behind the Children of Fallen Patriots Foundation
*(25:00) - How to have a day-job and start a non-profit organization
*(27:20) - The skill set overlap between Apax and Children of the Fallen Patriots Foundation
*(31:20) - SOP - Standard Operating Procedure
*(37:10) - What David currently focuses on
*(39:40) - Giving Back
Links
Connect with David on LinkedIn
Children of Fallen Patriots Foundation
Connect with Old Grad Club on LinkedIn
[00:01:42] Welcome to On Point. I'm Eddie Kang, founder of the Old Grad Club and your host for today, I'm joined by a very special guest. David Kim, [00:02:00] David, how are you today?
[00:02:01] David: Doing great. Thanks for having me on Eddie.
[00:02:03] Eddie: Awesome. Well, first off, thanks a lot for joining. We are fellow east Asian studies majors at west point. Interesting fact. So you know, to back it up a little bit, you know, where did you grow up and how did you end up, um, thinking about going in the military academy, what was the whole process for, you know, uh, you eventually joining the military?
[00:02:22] David: Yeah. So I grew up in Northern Virginia in Springfield, just on the beltway. So, um, a couple of different paths to how I ended up at west point, I guess, first of all, many, many members of my family have served in the military over, over the years, going back to the revolution. I had a great, my grandmother, grandfather was in Pickett's charge in the civil war.
[00:02:41] Um, so we've had multiple generations of folks in the U S armed forces. And then interestingly enough, my father. As a Korean immigrant and spoke English and fought with the American troops against the communists didn't the Korean war. And, um, so I think, you know, that was one big reason why I went to west point.
[00:02:58] I also, [00:03:00] secondly, got to know a number of different west pointers who were stationed in the area, just thought extremely highly of them and their character. And thirdly, I just really wanted to do something to serve the country and, you know, sense of patriotism and fourthly. Those also from a practical perspective, escaping a very bad, uh, homesick.
[00:03:16] Eddie: Gotcha. You know, when it comes to everybody's path to west point, what we found is like, it's a super, uh, it's always like, uh, there's always some unique story behind it, but you, you went and it seems like you'd really crush it there. Top 3% of your class. Were you always really competitive growing up? Like w or was that kind of where you found yourself in and were able to become successful
[00:03:36] David: there?
[00:03:36] Oh, I did pretty well in high school, I guess. For whatever reason, you know, been able to do okay. When it comes to grades. And so west point's a total grind and gotta just knock it out. But fortunately things in. Pretty well there academically. Uh, and you know, I really didn't enjoy a lot of the classes. I'm sure.
[00:03:56] Like, uh, like a lot of us felt like we're just trying to survive getting [00:04:00] blasted by the fire hose, but there are a number of classes that I thought were really interesting. East Asian studies is one of them. And I guess turning out to be particularly relevant, given the trend lines between China and the United States.
[00:04:10] Um, and also I thought Melara was just a fantastic course.
[00:04:13] Eddie: Yeah, absolutely. And so you end up branching FFA. Can you talk a little bit about, uh, You grew up in Northern Virginia, you're at west point. You do really well. There, you branch out Fe what were you thinking there? Were you thinking 20? Were you thinking five?
[00:04:27] Like how many years do you want to spend in the military? Um, at that point,
[00:04:32] David: no idea. I was just like a, you know, 22 year old knucklehead and kind of doing my thing and not really planning too far ahead. So I, I thought that our territory was interesting. It was a combination of, you know, sort of. Um, you know, not sort of what, uh, being a combat arms branch, uh, being on the ground, you know, with the infantry.
[00:04:52] Cause I was in a light unit, I thought that was very appealing. I also liked the intellectual aspect of it because a, you know, a lot of math and, and thinking [00:05:00] involved. And if you shoot one bullet out of the boundary, then you're going to get fired or even worse, kill somebody. Uh, I enjoy the combination of that.
[00:05:07] And, uh, yeah, I went to ranger school after OBC and really enjoy the time serving in that light infantry division, which is a seventh idea at that time.
[00:05:16] Eddie: Yeah. That, that, and so how many years did you do active duty before? Uh, heading over to HBS.
[00:05:23] David: I was only like three and a half years. So I got out, you know, in 91 in the wake of the cold war when they were letting people out or.
[00:05:31] From their service commitment. And, um, so, you know, a couple of things had happened, probably some immaturity on my part about w w you know, getting out early. I don't think there were there wasn't a particular reason. Yeah, there's a couple of things that I was maybe in a mature mindset irritated about, uh, in my army experience, I thought, well, I'll just move on and go do the, do the next thing.
[00:05:49] Like I said, I was a bit of a knucklehead and not planning ahead too much, but, uh, anyway, I'm very grateful for my time in uniform. And I think, uh, to be honest, it's one of the reasons why [00:06:00] I, I felt compelled to continue to serve in some way going forward, because you know, there's a little bit of a job not finished in that.
[00:06:09] Eddie: Yeah. And so, you know, after HBS, you spend a couple of times a years there and then you, you jumped kind of right into. The private equity world. Is that right? Yes.
[00:06:20] David: Yes. Uh, I was very, uh, blessed to be able to do that. You know, I was at business school. You do encounter a lot of the attitude from hiring companies of, okay, well you come out of the military, you don't know how to do spreadsheets.
[00:06:34] You've never done strategy consulting. What, what can I do with you? You're kind of useless. Um, and so. It was a kind of a struggle. And I found out he had no idea what private equity he was walking into business school. I just kind of walked around to people and what's investment banking. What's consulting, you know, what's private equity and landed on it that way.
[00:06:53] And, uh, you know, out of the blue, I got a call one afternoon in the spring as I was job searching too, to not [00:07:00] much good effect with a guy who had worked with some vets. And he ran a private, uh, private equity, a venture capital fund, and was looking for a summer intern. And so a week later I had the job there and then parlayed that into a job on the buyout side.
[00:07:17] Cause I, I think my skillset kind of lent itself a little bit more on the buyout side versus venture cap. But, uh, you know, it was kind of a very blessed, uh, occasion, I guess, or sort of a little bit of a experience of a divine intervention in my mind in terms of why that happened, but it worked out pretty well.
[00:07:33] Eddie: So the first, the first firm that you were at Butler capital, can you, can you tell us a little bit about that and how was it, do you think it was like relationships skillsets? Like, what was the. You know, what allowed you to kind of make that transition, which, you know, for, you know, everybody listening is a really, obviously it's a very difficult transition to make.
[00:07:53] David: I think Butler capital, I joined there in 1994, had a billion dollar fund. It was raised in [00:08:00] the late eighties. And so at that point in time, there were very few private equity funds that actually had a billion dollars under that's a huge
[00:08:06] Eddie: fund right back at that time,
[00:08:09] David: at that time. Yeah. And I just got very fortunate to find the group of people that they had a lot of respect for the military service.
[00:08:16] And they just had an open mind about being able to teach the technical skills required. Which of course I didn't have, I didn't have any banking or particularly grade spreadsheet experience. Now, now at that point in time spreadsheets weren't. You know, as sophisticated where today people were still using Lotus, if you can believe that.
[00:08:33] Um, so it was much less of a, of a driver than it is today, but, but fundamentally they just had that open mind about, we can teach you the technical part of what we need you to know, but what we value is the judgment and so forth. And so, uh, it was kind of a combination of those things that.
[00:08:49] Eddie: Your first job, when you were working at Butler, what did that look like?
[00:08:53] Cause everybody has this glamorized view of what private equity might've been or what venture capital is, but what were you actually doing on a day-to-day [00:09:00] basis?
[00:09:00] David: Sure. So, um, you know, when I was doing the venture capital internship over the summer, between years of business school, that was very much a dial for dollars operation where, you know, you're, you're researching a particular industry or sub-sector and call.
[00:09:15] Uh, all the companies that you can identify and calling the officer's entrepreneurs and trying to figure out, you know, how fast they're growing and how they're positioned and develop a relationship with that person. And, uh, over the phone, you know, back in 1994, there was no zoom, you know, there was no, uh, there wasn't any email, there were no cell phones, there was no anything.
[00:09:32] So, so that was a big, big part of what I did. And then, um, you know, at Butler capital, which was buyout focused as opposed to venture capital, there's a little bit less. Because the target set was bigger, more mature cashflow, positive companies, more in manufacturing, distribution, and so forth in the case of Butler capital.
[00:09:50] But the fundamentals of the hustle were still there. Right? You still, you still has got to contact entrepreneurs directly. Do your research on the spaces that you're interested in, who are the [00:10:00] winners? Get to know them? Same thing with the bankers though, because the bankers are intermediary and, uh, you know, being an intermediary on many deals.
[00:10:06] And so there was a lot of that and. And not only working the phones, but going to see people and developing relationships with them face-to-face and flying around the country. And, uh, so that, that continued, you know, very much, um, through my time at Butler capital. Now there's a weighting of your activity.
[00:10:24] When you first start, obviously you're doing a lot more running numbers and due diligence and things like that, then deal sourcing initially. But over time, the deal sourcing picks up, you know, a lot more important than a bigger portion of your.
[00:10:39] Eddie: Gotcha
[00:10:39] David: where you good at that? I like to think. So, uh, had some measure of success doing that and did a number of deals.
[00:10:46] And I think that's one of the reasons why, you know, why my CEO at the time asked me to lead the fundraising team is because I've been doing so much. In my deal role out there, just banging on doors and getting to know people and flying around and [00:11:00] seeing them and thinking about how you prioritize your efforts and what is it that you, what's your angle here with, with this person that we're talking to.
[00:11:07] And, you know, all of that is very applicable in the fundraising side is the same way it was on the, on the deal doing
[00:11:12] Eddie: side. So to take us back to, I don't know if it was like a, like a F like a, was it like a pit, like a boiler room type scenario? Uh, where you're, you're dialing all these, you know, what you assume are cashflow positive, private equity companies, legacy manufacturing, businesses, um, that you could potentially buy and how many people can listen in to the phone calls that you're making.
[00:11:35] Are you successful in the beginning? Like what does success really mean? And did you know what you were doing? Like in the beginning? Like how did this work? Yeah,
[00:11:42] David: I was doing the venture capital and internship, but I had no idea what I was doing and just had to get trained up and we had some good people, but there was only three of us.
[00:11:49] It was a small. At that point doing it. And so that, but that's great. That creates more opportunity, right? For D to get out there and hustle. And then on the Butler capital side, [00:12:00] same basic idea. Again, a small firm, there were maybe 10 of us that were in deal doing professionals. A few of us that were young.
[00:12:07] So it really wasn't like a sort of a boiler room, you know, where there's a lot of metrics and symbol, your supervisor walking around behind you to listen in on your calls and stuff and smacked into the back of the head. But, but, uh, but yeah, we sit down and go through our deal pipeline and, and, and our call sheets.
[00:12:22] And who are we talking to and why? And what's our angle. And it's really more about what I learned. It's not about selling. Really, if you have that in your head, you're just going to kind of bug people and come across as a schmoozer or too aggressively and too transactionally. And that's really not even how to be successful in the long run.
[00:12:40] Anyway, it's really to understand what is it that we're good at? What is it exactly that we can do to be healthy? To this company, like which company should we go talk to where our skillset is going to matter, because we may not be able to help a certain type of company, a certain industry. And so, you know, if you have that attitude of just, [00:13:00] you know, I'm not trying to sell you something, I'm trying to just structure a win-win here and I've done it in a thoughtful way.
[00:13:06] And this is why I think it could be a win-win. And that's what I'd like to talk to you about. And, uh, and then, you know, have a discussion and I call it the kind of the open Palm approach as opposed to. Grab onto something, you kind of have your hand open and, and the person kind of comes in, you know, the bird flies to your hand, if you will.
[00:13:22] Eddie: Yeah. I mean, I feel like these days, you know, we talk to a lot of people that want to join some type of investing career path or, or a private equity firm. Your story is unique. And that, I don't think a lot of people actually get that shot sometimes to say like, Hey, you know, we'll build you from the ground up.
[00:13:39] Um, you were in the military, but we'll teach you this. Um, it seems like the economy is moving in such that, um, There, there's kind of like a scarcity of either of those types of roles or they just go to people that are, that come from more traditional career paths. Like I went to Harvard for undergrad and I went to Goldman for a couple of years of banking.
[00:13:57] And now I'm going to go join some buyout firm or something like that. [00:14:00]
[00:14:01] David: The industries. Tremendously rise 27 years ago, completely different world now in the private equity space. And so, um, hiring is conducted much more formulaically, I think certainly, um, amongst the large firms, the multi-billion dollar firms, it is that career path is exactly what you just described.
[00:14:19] And I would encourage transitioning military veterans to, to, to really work hard, to find a more entrepreneurial situations. That's where I think you're going to find me. Uh, some lucky breaks or some, some more open-minded out of the box approaches to hiring, which was the case with Butler capital. You know, I wrote letters to, you know, basically everybody, uh, in the private equity space and did a lot of, you know, just work the shoe leather express, right.
[00:14:45] Cold calling and so forth. And, and that's how Butler capital kind of popped out of things. And, and so just do the same thing, hustle, you know, and look for those entrepreneurial situations where, you know, people may be more apt to think out of the box about the qualifications of the people that are.
[00:14:59] Eddie: [00:15:00] Yep.
[00:15:00] Gotcha. And when it comes to the work your first few years at Butler capital, was it what you expected? Like if, I don't know if you can take yourself back to that mindset, but you'd just been probably a junior officer in the military for three years. Couple of years of business. How different was that experience compared to like what you kind of thought and looking back, like to the military help you, or was it more just like a clean slate starting from starting from the beginning again?
[00:15:27] David: Um, well, I, I didn't really know what to expect. I'd never worked in that type of office environment. You know, being in the military are always in the motor pool or out in the field. Right. Or working with the troops. And so I had no clue. Um, but I, I really liked the people and the people were just fantastic that I worked with.
[00:15:44] And at the end of the day, I think that's a huge part of anybody's success and, and job satisfaction is liking the people in the cold. And so from that standpoint, it really far exceeded my, my expectations. I think from a work standpoint, it was even better than, than [00:16:00] I sort of had imagined in my mind, the intellectual variety that you encounter in the private equity space is really stimulating and challenging.
[00:16:08] So I enjoyed that. And then thirdly, I, I always liked being in small teams. Uh, you know, it was one of the reasons I like being in artillery and, uh, working with my fist team of, you know, it was only. People. And so the private equity space should also work in very small teams and, and it's very entrepreneurial and you make decisions quickly and you feel like you're, you're doing something important in terms of contributing to the team and not just a cog in the wheel.
[00:16:31] So I enjoyed that as well.
[00:16:32] Eddie: Gotcha. And at some point you leave Butler to go to apex, which is, I thought like at the, at the time was also a bigger fund than Butler, right?
[00:16:41] David: Uh, yes, exactly. So that learner just made the decision and he was kind of in retirement mode. And so he decided to go ahead and wind down the firm.
[00:16:50] And so that's what prompted my move to was at that point Saundra's carpet McGrew, which is another middle market, private equity fund with around a similar size. Fund, [00:17:00] uh, SKM merged in the apex in 2005. And so I've been with, uh, the, you know, the firm ever since 2000 for all practical purposes.
[00:17:10] Eddie: Gotcha. And did your role change when you moved to the.
[00:17:13] How did you think about career progression? Obviously you've stayed on the same platform for like a really long time, but was it, you know, what usually led to being at the same place for, you know, over the same amount of time that people would make a career out of the army essentially,
[00:17:26] David: or I, I really drained SKM.
[00:17:29] I've really enjoyed. Apex has been, been an amazing ride. And so I think that's one of the reasons why I've been here for so long. Uh, you know, a lot of the same dynamics that I mentioned where it's very entrepreneurial place work in small teams, the culture is really great. We don't have this sort of eat what you kill sharp elbowed wall, street culture at all.
[00:17:48] So it's very collaborative and I really value that coming out of the military. Right. You don't have to watch your back. And you're working as a team. You're not so worried about, you know, what exact credit I'm getting versus other people and so forth. And so [00:18:00] the cultural aspects are great. The areas that we invest are very intellectually stimulating.
[00:18:05] The firm's got a great track record. I've learned. You know, incredible amount from the people that I've worked with and, you know, seeing them, uh, and, and the way that they think about approaching problems and opportunities. And so it depends a tremendous lifelong learning experience. So I think for all of those reasons, it's been, it's been a great ride.
[00:18:23] I feel like it's been, you know, 21 years at apex because it's gone by so fast, but I I've really enjoyed it. And I'm going to have to retire and a little bit over like four and a half years. Cause we have a 60 year old retirement policy coming in on the home stretch
[00:18:39] Eddie: here. To me that seems early. Is that, is that common across different firms?
[00:18:43] Like 60 doesn't seem that old to me.
[00:18:45] David: No, it's not common at all in the us. I think maybe a little bit more so in Europe. It's sort of common. I believe in a lot of the consulting and accounting firms and so forth in our contact. I think it's actually a very healthy thing because [00:19:00] it just promotes vertical mobility for the rising superstars, you know, re we recalibrate the carry with the start of every fund.
[00:19:08] And as people are rising up the ranks, you know, because you don't have a top heavy structure with a lot of the carry getting dedicated to these. Older people who, you know, may or may not be working a hundred percent anymore. You know, it promotes a lot of Oracle mobility and we can reward those rising superstars.
[00:19:24] So I think that works well. And, and, uh, you know, there's always a lot of other interesting things to go do in life. And so I'll be looking forward to that next phase in life.
[00:19:33] Eddie: Yeah. I mean, it's a good question. Cause like w what does retirement mean for you? Does that mean going to work another job? And, and the other thing too, is like, it sounds like you keep super busy with the non-profit that you founded.
[00:19:45] You know, you, you, you founded children in the fallen Patriots somewhat quickly after joining apex. Is that right? Yeah, that's right.
[00:19:52] David: We started it in officially launched in January of 2002. We would have been working all during 2001 to get it [00:20:00] started. We did a market study and work with an HBS professor on that and filed our paperwork and then the, then 9 1 1 happened.
[00:20:08] And so it all came together. There. And so that's been my, my, I call it my 10 to midnight job and, and so the way I raised money all day long, I raised money for apex by day, and then by night for fallen Patriots. And it's been a, it's been a lot of work, but it's been, you know, I think a true passion and, and calling my wife and I call it her.
[00:20:30] Child. And it's honestly, it's an honor, you know, to be able to do it and stay connected to the military and especially to those gold star families who lost someone in line of,
[00:20:39] Eddie: but yeah, I mean, it's a, it's a good opportunity. I mean, can you give us, like, in your own words first off, like why you started the organization and then also obviously like what it does?
[00:20:49] David: Sure. Well, I started it, uh, really an honor, a Sergeant Delaney. He, and I were in the same battalion in 89 when we were deployed down to Panama to [00:21:00] remove Noriega during operation, just cause. And so we were there on the ground when it kicked off and unfortunately he got killed in the fighting. And that was, uh, just a few days before Christmas.
[00:21:11] And he had a baby daughter doing. And so, and he was only 21, so I didn't know him personally, but yeah, he was the only member of our battalion that got killed. And obviously with, with, with a baby on the way that really kind of hits double heart. And, and so I just kept thinking about, you know, his daughter and what's going to happen to her.
[00:21:29] Who's going to take care of her. And as you know, you know, there are thousands of, of children like her. And so we started the foundation with a mission to. Our fallen by investing in the people that they care most about in the world, which other kids cause all of us who have kids, you know, the sure. The last thing that would go through our mind is what's gonna happen to my family.
[00:21:51] And so we want to be there to, to honor their sacrifice by, by taking care of their kids.
[00:21:56] Eddie: So to date, I mean, you've been running this [00:22:00] organization for nearly, for two decades. How many kids have you all had sponsored? How many, how much money have you all raised? Like, I understand the organization's been super successful
[00:22:10] David: then very fortunate.
[00:22:12] The American public loves the military. Oftentimes doesn't know how. Military because so few people serve, but once you make that connection, it's really powerful. And that's what I think explains a lot of the results that we've been able to achieve. So we've helped over 2000 students go to college, uh, just about 900 have graduated.
[00:22:30] Debt-free we've provided at this point about $48 million. In support to those students to go to college, it'll be 50 million by the end of the year, cause we're growing quickly. So we've made a start in total. There are about 25,000 students over the last 35 years. Who've lost a parent in the line of duty I say about because no one knows exactly how many there are, you know, the government, isn't fantastic at customer service, as you might imagine.
[00:22:57] And, uh, and [00:23:00] bits and pieces of it all over the place. But, but that's okay. That's why we're here to fill in the gaps. And then number two, The VA does provide assistance for college for Goldstar students, but it doesn't cover the full cost of college. It leaves about on average $25,000, a person gap for four years of school.
[00:23:17] And so times 25,000 students at 625 million. So that's the total need that we're trying to. Financially. And then we're also trying to find all 25,000 of those students. Believe it or not. No other charity knows where all that they all are. So we found 10,000 at this point, and we want to close that gap to 25.
[00:23:35] So those are our twin strategic.
[00:23:37] Eddie: So is there, I imagine there's some, uh, somebody working at the children, fallen Patriots, trying to find like, how are they, are they looking at all these units, seeing who's Kia and trying to see if they have like family? Is that what it is? Or,
[00:23:52] David: yeah, so we have 23 people on staff.
[00:23:55] Full-time F on Patriots, down in the DC area in Dallas. [00:24:00] We do have, um, about half of our staff are themselves Goldstar students that we help graduate from college. And they're the ones doing the outreach to their peers to provide them the financial need and whatever emotional counseling they needed and so forth.
[00:24:12] And then a couple of those people are specifically focused on enrolling new students into the system, and that's really completed on a top down and a bottoms up basis. So top down is we, we work with the VA very closely. To leverage the services they're providing to these gold star students to, to assist in that we've got a very good working relationship with them.
[00:24:33] Um, secondly, we worked directly with the armed forces, so the army in particular, I'm very, very proud of that has a great program where they track survivors and make known to them charities like fallen Patriots. So that's been very beneficial. And then on the bottoms up, we work with sister groups, sister charities that are serving gold star families and maybe doing other things.
[00:24:53] And we do and, and approaching them the units directly and, and things like that. So that's how really, we've been able to find all [00:25:00] these families. Gotcha.
[00:25:01] Eddie: How hard was it to start? You know, this old grad club is a nonprofit in itself and we, you know, we try to balance building this organization with our day jobs.
[00:25:10] You were working in a highly competitive and, you know, notoriously time intensive industry and private equity while starting or founding children of fallen Patriots. Well, can you tell us, do those beginning days? Like how did you do it?
[00:25:23] David: Well, um, just, you know, like they say, eat the elephant one bite at a time.
[00:25:29] And, uh, so he just knocked it out day by day. In retrospect, you know, there is a, if you're going to do the way I did it, which is sort of as a, as a sideline activity is just expect to work a lot after hours. And on the weekends, like every Saturday, pretty much I'm working on, you know, fallen Patriots and in odd hours and things like that.
[00:25:50] So there's no substitute for just good old fashioned. And, uh, and then fortunately we've have found a lot of folks that love the military. There are a lot of people that are veterans that are [00:26:00] on the board, but just a lot of folks out there who never served, but really appreciate what the military does for us.
[00:26:05] And so they've been tremendous in, uh, instrument in, in, in our ability to grow. So I think finding allies is super important. You know, you gotta have a good team on, on board and, um, and people always ask me, you know, I've got this idea for a charity. Can you give me some advice? My first piece of advice is.
[00:26:23] Because it's brutal. And you know, all of the administrative things, you have to do the costs that you have to incur the financial ratios and the governance and the plethora of, uh, charities that are out there. There's really no need to start a new charity, right. Because it, somebody is guaranteed doing at least part, if not all of what you're doing, just partner up with.
[00:26:46] And what charities have the hardest time doing is finding people who actually want to work hard and raise money. And a lot of people have the good idea fairy about what you should go do, but they don't want to go do it themselves. And so if you show up and say, Hey, I've got this passion to [00:27:00] work and raise money.
[00:27:00] I'd like to leverage the existing infrastructure and foundation that you have with some measure of autonomy for me. So that it's fun. I would think a lot of charities would be very interested in doing that and that, that therefore you can focus on what's. Which is raising the money and helping the families and not all of the, you know, infrastructure and logistical pulmonologist.
[00:27:20] So.
[00:27:21] Eddie: Yeah. Do you feel like your day job gets you or your nonprofit work makes you better at the other? I mean, you, you raise money for both. Is it the S do the pools ever overlap or is that something that's kind of taboo or,
[00:27:34] David: oh, um, well, I, I don't mix, uh, personal business with, with business business. Um, so I try to keep it very bright line there, but certainly the skill sets and, and lessons learned have been incredibly valuable.
[00:27:46] I, uh, I co-head our fundraising team at apex. And so I look after north and south America, that's about half our capital that we raised. We just raised an $11 billion buyout fund. We have about $60 billion in capital, under management. [00:28:00] You know, all of those subtle techniques and process, discipline points and things like that around raising money are extremely valuable for fallen Patriots.
[00:28:08] Number one, number two, I would say that, you know, the business well, the private equity mindset, right. Of having skin in the game of managing. Of having discipline, uh, focus and, uh, and lean operations and accountability have been very, very valuable. And I think very distinctive and people appreciate it because a lot of the times our, our partners are themselves businesses and they really look hard at how well you're run just as a business.
[00:28:34] And so that's also been very valuable, uh, the networks that I've developed over time. Both in the business world, in the, in growing, living in Greenwich, Connecticut for a long time, that's also been incredibly beneficial and then having the military experience as well, the weekend. Has also been beneficial.
[00:28:52] So it's been a little bit of this virtuous cycle. That's worked very well together as the support phone
[00:28:56] Eddie: page. Yeah. It's um, it's a, it's a cool story. [00:29:00] When did you transition actually at apex to the I R side? Cause I don't think you started there, right? No,
[00:29:05] David: I was originally a partner in our deal, uh, side, so that, and I started out doing deals in, in 94.
[00:29:11] And so I spent the first 15 years of my career doing deals and is focused kind of mostly in the consumer. Area. And then in 2009, we wanted to expand our fundraising team. And so that's. Our CEO asked me to, to lead the north American where the America is really for fundraising to be able to do that.
[00:29:28] Didn't want to do that with deal people as opposed to just salespeople, so that we can convey the subtleties of the investment strategy. And you know, what went right? What went wrong, why we're doing these deals, uh, because we have, you know, the dealer experience and my partner who's in London and looks and looks after the rest of the world has the same type of, uh, background
[00:29:46] Eddie: for our audience that might not have the.
[00:29:48] $60 billion just seems like a lot of money who are the types of people slash organizations or endowments institutions that you're talking to to raise that kind of money.
[00:29:58] David: It's institutional money, [00:30:00] obviously, because of the size of the funds that we're raising and the checks that you need to raise to go along with that.
[00:30:04] So it's global sovereign wealth funds, it's public pension funds. Um, like you would see for, you know, the teacher's union in a certain state or what have you. And there are. Uh, a lot of private pension funds as well, companies that have pensions insurance companies are a big source of money. The, the high net worth channel is also a very important there with accredited investors that invest in private equity.
[00:30:31] So it's a combination of all of the above, but mostly institutional money
[00:30:34] Eddie: and for a firm as big as apex are you, are you constantly. Or at least having those conversations, you know, you turn over funds somewhat quickly. Right. And it's a lot of capital. I imagine you, you have to have those conversations pretty consistently.
[00:30:48] David: Yes. We, we raise funds essentially every three and a half years on average three and a half, four years, but we have multiple different strategies of funds that we raise. And, and so we have [00:31:00] 1, 2, 3, 4, Five different pots of capital. They're doing different things that we're raising money for. And so that more or less, we're always in the market with something, but, but believe it or not for, for the peers that we have, you know, a lot of our peers have many, many more.
[00:31:16] Types of funds that they're raising. So, but it, but it works well for us and we've, we've seen the results.
[00:31:21] Eddie: Let's get into our next segment, the SOP or standard operating procedure in this segment, we're going to talk about the personal routines, habits and words to live by that have been instrumental to our guests success.
[00:31:33] You know, you started your career. Uh, obviously in the military spent some time Butler had been on the investing side at apex, as well as the fundraising side and all the while somehow found it an extremely successful nonprofit. Have there been anything, um, any tidbits of knowledge or ha patterns of behavior habits on a daily basis that you do that you kind of address?
[00:31:56] To your success across the different phases of your life?
[00:31:58] David: Yeah. That's a good question. Well, [00:32:00] I, you know, first of all, I just distributed the, you know, the success, you know, to God, to give him credit for that. Because honestly that if you asked me, what's the one thing that's been most important, that's it?
[00:32:10] And so that's incredibly important to me. And, and my family and I I've seen it manifest itself in so many ways you can say, oh, that's a coincidence. Or it's, it's actually, you know, uh, you know, God gonna kind of helping, um, you know, see how you like. But, but anyway, that, that's the first thing that I would point to.
[00:32:28] Secondly, I haven't tried to be all things, all people like I'm very, very focused, right. Where, you know, I think there's this view in the world today that you can have everything you can. Yeah, your wife and yourself can both have giant careers and you can do all these different things and your kids can do all these different things.
[00:32:44] You can do sports and be involved in million different activities. And I just have never subscribed to that. And so the focus has really been very, very important. A lot of things we'd edited out of our lives so that we can go very deep into the things that we've made a priority. [00:33:00] And, and, uh, and that goes to our family life as well.
[00:33:03] And, and. That balance both professionally and in our family life has been very important to the ability to grow.
[00:33:11] Eddie: What are some of those things that you've edited out actually?
[00:33:14] David: Well, um, you know, as an example, um, my wife, uh, you know, she's a, co-founder fallen Patriots and, you know, when it was just the two of us in our house, she was the one picking up the phone and working, uh, with our families.
[00:33:26] And, and I was the one raising money and kind of handling the business side of things. And so. You know, both of us can't do a daytime job and a nighttime job and have four children. Like we, like we have, or I know we lose our minds. And so, you know, for her, that was her priority, which is, you know, our family and, and fallen Patriots.
[00:33:45] And that's why we call it our fifth, fifth child, really. So that's one of those things, right, where we made that trade off of, of how that was going to work, um, in our personal life, you know, as an example, I mentioned how much I have to work right between apex and fallen Patriots and a lot of that's [00:34:00] on the weekends and at nights and things like that.
[00:34:03] You know, we just didn't want to be scattered all over the place with kids sports. So that was something that we were also very careful about. We didn't ha we don't, you know, have athletes in the family that we just obvious tremendous, you know, collegiate athletes or something like that. And one of my sons is actually, but, but, but the rest of them weren't and so, you know, we chose not to spend a lot of time on the weekends, running around at lacrosse games that.
[00:34:24] Sunday morning, all day long and things like that. And so things like that are just trying to edit down what we're doing to focus and go deep on the things that were most important to us.
[00:34:32] Eddie: Yeah. It sounds like you're you're you and your wife have really come at it with a lot of intent on like where you spend your time.
[00:34:39] What is worthwhile. And interestingly, I, you have, I don't know how many of your kids, but a couple of them went to west point,
[00:34:45] David: right? Yes. Yes. So we have, uh, our oldest boys as a Firstie on one of our daughters. She's a twin. Uh, she's a plebe. So she just finished. Beast. And that's really great. I did the March back with her, which was [00:35:00] really fantastic.
[00:35:01] And, um, we have our middle son is a junior at U Chicago and got recruited to play on the football team. So he's, he is the good athlete that I was talking about. And that's interesting. Yeah, he's doing great. And then, um, Molly's twin, uh, Elise, she's going to U Penn. Actually, we dropped her off next. So we're going to be the empty nesters.
[00:35:22] Eddie: Gosh, I, the twins, I feel like their, their experience going into freshman year is going to be just so different. Um, but it's going to be interesting to watch. Um, yeah. And your boy, your son, I think at U Chicago. I went there for business school. I think it's a, it's a great, uh, academic institution. So
[00:35:42] David: it really is.
[00:35:43] Yeah, it is a real way
[00:35:44] Eddie: for kids really, really successful, uh, schools, you know, at least on the academic side. It's you must be really proud of that. Well,
[00:35:52] David: yeah, we're very proud of them. They're all great kids and work super hard and have their heads screwed on straight, I think with some good, good values.
[00:35:59] [00:36:00] And part of that, I think is the fact that we spend a lot of time together as a family. Like I mentioned, You know, run all over the place, doing these weekend sports, you know, just hear everyone complained about how exhausted they were. And I was exhausted one day, I was literally out of the cross game on a Sunday morning and it was pouring rain and my guys were playing and I'm like, I hadn't seen my wife, you know, I'm worried about them getting their homework done that night.
[00:36:22] I had to do this work. I'm like, why exactly am I doing this? Yeah. And then my wife and I, we had time to have date nights on Saturday. And then on Sunday we said, look guys, um, nobody does it. Get your homework done on Saturday. I'll get my work done on Saturday. Do your sports and school during the week.
[00:36:43] And we're going to have, you know, observed the Sabbath. Then we're going to have family day and just take a nap or play a game or whatever, watch a movie and just be together. So it was just little things like that, that we really tried to focus on that, you know, I think helped the family
[00:36:56] Eddie: situation.
[00:36:57] Gotcha. And so now it sounds like. [00:37:00] All of your kids are in college. You are. I dunno. How many years away from forced retirement and apex? How different is your day? These days when it comes to how hard you work, how many hours you put in? Um, maybe it's, I don't know. Where you're really focused, but you know, you still seem like a really young guy with tons of energy.
[00:37:20] What do you want to do at this point in your life from really focusing?
[00:37:23] David: Yeah. Well, it's, it's kinda funny to like where, where, you know, this next phase in life, I've got four and a half years until after retired APACS and with the kids now being out, doing their own thing, it actually frees up more time for me to do what I love, which is work.
[00:37:35] And, you know, I really, I really enjoy what I do at apex. And so, you know, I can, I have one less conflict, right? If I need to do something at night during the week, it's fine. Like kids, aren't sort of pulling at me to do whatever. And, you know, I've got time on the weekends to do things with fallen Patriots and so forth.
[00:37:52] And so I don't really have many big hobbies. I don't golf and you know, and I kind of, you know, it's really, my, my fun is doing fallen [00:38:00] Patriots, so, and my wife too. And so that's actually kind of fun. I mean, we're looking forward to it. We enjoy what we're doing in life now. What comes next? I have no idea for sure.
[00:38:08] I'll, I'll spend more time on fallen Patriots and, uh, hopefully I've little bit more free time to just spend the time with the kids and whatever, but I'm definitely not going to retire. You know, I mean, I definitely would like to be doing something different with maybe a little bit more control over my school.
[00:38:26] Yeah.
[00:38:27] Eddie: And I'm sure you'll probably fly to visit your kids installing that. But, um, when it comes to, when you say work harder, like I imagine apex ones are oversubscribed every time. Like people are probably like clamoring to put or institutions probably really lining them to put money in there. What does that mean?
[00:38:43] Like you just get to that mark faster or, you know, it's different. Like what does success, I guess mean for you in that regard?
[00:38:49] David: Oh, well, you know, without good, I can't go into any specifics around apex fundraising for, you know, solicitation rules and things like that. But it just means that I just have more time to be able to spend on the various things that we're [00:39:00] doing at apex and, uh, you know, whatever new strategies we may be looking at or building the team or, um, you know, whatever.
[00:39:08] There's always a lot of things that. Focus on productively. And so it's great to be able to have time to do that. And same thing goes with regard to fallen Patriots because, you know, we're, we're growing, we just hired a president, uh, who is running a $500 million business right now. And his he's a retired Navy pilot.
[00:39:27] So, uh, I think, you know, he's, I think he's going to do great things to help us grow. So there's always a lot there. And, and so that's, that's what I mean is like more time to be able to focus on, uh, on those projects.
[00:39:38] Eddie: All right. It's time for our final segment, giving back. A lot of our listeners are somewhere between the ages of 25 and 40 trying to scale in their careers.
[00:39:48] If you were to, you know, think of some type of advice that's been helpful to you, what, what would you be willing to tell the audience kind of on how to achieve [00:40:00] your version of success?
[00:40:02] David: Yeah. Well, I think, um, I think I'm going to get specific to the veteran community because I think we have maybe a different definition of success in some respects than what a lot of people do, which is number one.
[00:40:15] You're never gonna be able to scratch that itch on that service and comradeship that we, you know, get satisfied while we're in uniform. That was a big surprise to me. When I got out is how much I missed the people and miss the comradery and missed that sense of mission and purpose. And it's just not going to be there in the civilian world.
[00:40:32] You know, there's a lot of great places and great people. It's just, it's just a different contract. It's just not going to be there. So if that's important to you, then find a way to keep that alive. Right. And so that fallen Patriots is, is my calling from that perspective. And I think that's probably important almost all veterans is, is to keep that sense of purpose and service alive.
[00:40:51] Number one. So just tap into what your passion is and whatever that is, you know, get involved in it. Number two. I would say, you know, [00:41:00] Teddy Roosevelt's quote, do what you can with what you have, where you are right now. There's no, you know, oh, well, I'm going to make some money in 10 years and do something later.
[00:41:08] You know, it, it just doesn't work like that. Right. You got to just start with what your calling is in whatever way that you can do it now and be intentional, and then start to build your life around that. And over time, that will snowball as opposed to, you know, tomorrow. Type of thing. And so I guess those would be the two things I would say, tap into your passion and just get started today.
[00:41:31] And, uh,
[00:41:33] Eddie: David, I feel like your, the type of person that will do anything it takes to kind of get the job done. Like it just kind of comes out through the conversations that we've had. I guess throughout your life, you've proven that, um, whether it's like cold calling a million people to get into a certain industry or, you know, graduating top of your class or all these terms of things, like where do you think that started?
[00:41:54] David: Well, I, I had to get out of a bad family situation. So that was a very big impetus as one of the reasons why I [00:42:00] went to west point because I couldn't afford college and I needed to figure out a way to pay for it. And, and so, uh, are you
[00:42:06] Eddie: open to talking about it or is it something that you'd rather not.
[00:42:10] David: Well, I, I don't know how much more detailed would really be, even be helpful other than just, it was pretty bad family situation, right. With, and I'm on a number of different levels and the, and the financial piece was all. Important. And so, you know, w what do they say necessity is the mother of invention?
[00:42:25] So I was like, damn sure. Going to make sure I got out. And, uh, and so I think that laid a foundation, and I think my parents were incredibly hard workers that had a big aspect to it. My dad was, as I mentioned, a Korean immigrant, and, you know, he got captured by the Chinese, during the war. He escaped and went back to fighting.
[00:42:43] He won a S. To go to the journalism school at the university of Michigan, he took some national contest and be like, want to just a tiny handful of people to win. And so, you know, he was a grinder as well. My mother, she worked three jobs, single mom raising us. And, and so, um, [00:43:00] and then you go to the army, right.
[00:43:02] And, and you get that work ethic instilled there. And so I, you know, I think I that's, that's kinda what I would attribute it to. And, and to be honest with you again, and my faith is important to me and I just realized that. I didn't really realize it at the time, but now I look back, I just realized that, you know, I've been blessed in so many different ways.
[00:43:18] It has to be a very good steward of that. And, um, and so that's another motivation.
[00:43:23] Eddie: Yeah. It's um, uh, for people that do exceptional things, sometimes you have to reach exceptionally deep. And in order to do that, it seems like everybody has an experience or something or a purpose that leads them to be able to get to that, to take it to that extent.
[00:43:38] And, um, it's always interesting to hear those stories. It's also personally like your story kind of resonates a little bit more with mine cause we've kind of got like a shared Korean background, so, um, that's, that's helpful. But with that. That's all we have time for today, but I really appreciate, you know, all the insights your career has been inspirational.
[00:43:56] Uh, and I think that everybody listening will one learn a lot about are [00:44:00] certain industries, but also hopefully be able to take snippets home that will inspire them to be everything that they can be when it comes to their.
[00:44:09] David: Well, great. Well, thanks so much for having me on it's really great conversation and kind of flew by and, and good for you guys for doing this.
[00:44:14] And it gets awesome to create all this connectivity with the, with the community and, and, uh, kudos to doing something really entrepreneurial and, and in your own career. So it was really great to connect with you guys.
[00:44:25] Eddie: Awesome. Thanks a lot, David. Really appreciate it. Okay. Thank you.
[00:44:29] Producer: Thank you for listening to OnPoint.
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